176. Spartus Spitfire, Inferno 2, Joola FX News & Questions and Answers

Alright, what's up guys?

We are back with another podcast episode this week.

Today we're going to be talking about some interesting things I've just observed about

paddle grit recently or maybe like a little theory I have about grit as well as a handful

of paddles.

The Yola FX information has been released talking about the spartus spitfire, which a lot

of you have wanted us to cover the inferno to and then talking a little bit about the

veler command now that I have a weight set up on it.

And then we're going to dive into just our review process because with how many of you

are asking about the spitfire and being like, why haven't you hit it yet?

Why haven't you hit it yet?

I was like, you know, I always should probably go over this again and just talk about kind

of a deep dive on our whole thing.

And then in the kitchen we'll have some Q&A.

But before we get into that, I do have a question this week that I'd be very curious to know

the answer in the comments.

And that is how long does it typically take for you to notice your paddle losing spin and

what level are you?

Especially what I want to know is how long it takes you to notice if you are not touching

the face of your paddle because I think there are a lot of instances where someone could

not touch the face of their paddle.

They might not be thinking about it as much, but because everyone's always, you know,

kind of touching the face like, oh, that's as smooth as it not.

I feel like that'll put some stuff in your head a little bit.

So just let me know how long it takes for you to notice and then what your level is

because I'm very curious.

So all right, first thing I want to talk about is just paddle spin.

So obviously I've been doing a ton of grit testing recently.

There's all these long lasting grits, some that are still not.

And I had an interesting thought recently and we're going to talk a little bit more about

this when we get to the spitfire because that is definitely a paddle that sparked a little

bit of this debate.

But I'm starting to wonder.

So there are paddles like the 6.0 Coral Pro and 11.624's hex grit that are when you

touch them, it's a very like coarse grit.

The grit pieces all feel very big and you know, it'll feel very rough to the touch.

And then there is other types of grit where if we're talking about like the peaks and

valleys, the way I think about it is you have some that are just like bigger, wider

pieces of grit and then you have ones that are really sharp but really narrow.

And I think for durable grit to my hunch so far, I don't know that this is correct.

I'm completely spitballing is if it is a wider piece, you can have, you know, more embedded

grit particle, it'll make it stronger.

If it's very narrow but very sharp, it'll be easier to snap the tip.

But I'm starting to feel like those sharper tips that don't they feel rough but maybe

not ultra rough are almost better for high performance spin but maybe not long lasting

because even paddles that are quote unquote maybe smooth, something that I've been noticing

with again, you know, my silly little test of like dragging my hand across the face,

not that scientific.

But I have consistently found that even paddles with very smooth grit, if I do that, my

handle like not move like it does not want to slide across the face.

And then some of these paddles with, you know, objectively very rough textures, my hand

will slide across it a little bit more.

Not like, oh, it's slipping a ton but it'll just, it'll move, right?

And hex grade is one of those.

Obviously it gets great spins.

So I'm not trying to say, oh, these get worse spin.

But I am wondering if there's going to be a difference between what is really durable

and what is hyper performative.

And if those are going to clash with each other or not because some of these sharper,

more narrow peaks paddles, they feel like they get better spin to me.

I guess it comes down to, excuse me, comes down to what's the, the line at you draw

being high performance.

Yeah.

Like, okay, let's say in theory, the sharper peaks do at first hit and first few games

fresh, get more spin and more effective spin.

And it's, let's just throw number 2600.

But then the more durable grits are getting 2400.

Is that a big enough difference for you?

Because in my opinion, anything over 2300 is all great.

I mean, I would say even over 2100 is plenty fine.

Yeah.

So, I don't know, depends on where you draw the line.

Yeah, I think it's going to be interesting.

I mean, more is always better.

Yeah, of course.

And I feel like this conversation is going to continue to evolve.

Like, I, I think I would have put money on by the end of this year.

Durable grit would have largely been solved.

But I actually feel like I'm going to say that it's going to take another year at minimum.

Before we really know one, consistently that some of these are really long lasting or

two that they're really long lasting and very high performance.

Yeah.

I don't know.

I'm just, I'm very curious.

I feel like that gap is going to be a little bit split.

And I still think there is like the interesting conversation of, you know, all the spin tests

right now are from a baseline hitting serves.

That's obviously a smaller portion of the game.

Maybe that's more realistic for something like singles, but doubles is played at the kitchen

line.

And so are some of these grits going to be a little bit better at the kitchen line versus

not, you know, like, just it's very interesting.

I feel like as I continue to test more and more paddles for all this grit stuff, I'm

just like picking up on smaller things that I'm like, hmm, I feel like this is going to,

this conversation might look different next year.

Yeah.

I mean, there are definitely different grit textures that are better at certain shots

than others, right?

Yeah.

Like the P1 and was it permigrit?

Yeah.

Is in my opinion much better at slower swing speed, like mid court rolls than hex grit,

but they're both great, performative grits on spin.

Yeah.

But I think permigrit is just better at like getting spin at the kitchen.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's going to be so interesting to see.

I really wish we also had like a USIP was doing this for a bit.

And I think Cell Kirk also has one, but one of those 3D scanners to kind of look at a lot

of these grits because it'd be very interesting to see them at that granular level to kind of

know.

And the Spitfire is one in particular that I think it is a rough textured paddle.

It's not super smooth, but if you touch that versus hex grit, there's a very big difference

in how those feel to the touch with your hand.

One feels more fine.

One feels more coarse like I was saying.

Right.

And the other thing that made me think about this this morning is there are a lot of sports

where I feel like the most performative equipment is not the most durable.

And so like I, one example that came to my mind, which look, I'm not a runner, but

I feel like I know enough runners to have had this said to me.

And then I looked it up just to verify really quick, is there are foam shoes for like

marathons.

I think a lot of times they get called super shoes.

And basically it's like these are not going to last you very long.

Before that race, they are going to be faster and return more energy.

But that is not the shoe you're going to train in.

Yeah.

You're going to train in.

I think it's like a TPU shoe versus, let me see.

Did I write this down?

Where's Justin when you need him?

Seriously.

The shoe band.

I think it's the like super shoes have a carbon plate and they're like a Peba or PEBA

foam.

So it's just very interesting.

Like running is an example of, hey, look, you're going to run in something different

than or train in something different than what you would actually do the race with.

And I imagine as an obvious example, I'm not a runner here.

If I started running, it doesn't matter if I run in that TPU style shoe or if I run

in the super shoe.

Like, I'm probably not going to be that much better in a super shoe because my running

technique just sucks.

Right.

And so I think that's going to apply to pickleball as well.

I mean, my example is going to be the same thing.

Shoes in pickleball.

For me, not shoes in pickleball is very different for everybody.

I imagine running is as well.

But Jetmock 3 is the most performative shoe for me.

And I know a lot of people agree and say the same thing.

But durability is very lackluster.

I mean, I can burn through the outsole of those in about two and a half to three weeks.

But I will play in those for tournaments because it is the best shoe for me.

But then there are shoes that will last maybe two months, but feel like bricks on my feet.

And I can't, I just can't play well with them.

So it's a trade off.

And just like some other brief research I did, it seemed like this applied in a lot of

other sports as well.

Now granted, these are very quick searches.

So don't take my word entirely for this.

It sounds like table tennis has a similar thing with different rubbers where there are

some where like performance and spin is very good.

But it might only last a couple of weeks.

And then one that you might actually use very regularly or last longer is not going to

get as high as spin.

Same thing I think I saw with swimming and golf balls.

It sounds like some of the tour balls, they'll be softer, get better spin, but like they

might scuff easier or something.

So I'm just seeing a trend with other sports where the highest performing is not the most

durable.

And I'm very curious to see how that pans out for pickleball.

You know, like it makes me even think, you know, the reload concept never took off.

I think not because the concept itself was bad, I think the concept was good.

They just failed to innovate on the paddle side.

Like I feel like even with all the foam paddles now, like think how light some of these

are, like, I mean, think the Quanta Pro last year.

Think how ridiculously light those were.

You take the regular carbon fiber face off that and then slap a reload sheet on it.

It might not have been that heavy.

And could have potentially been a really performing, good performing paddle.

So it makes me wonder too if we'll ever see that come back now that cores are lasting

longer.

Like okay, here are the different types of grit you could have.

Let's just slap it on this face.

And then it's more like a tennis string or something.

I don't know.

I'm very curious to see where this will be in a year.

Well, after like revisit, you know, I'm a set of them.

I'll do my classic Apple reminder thing.

Remind me in one year to see what has happened to pick up all paddle grit for the podcast.

Nice.

There we go.

Okay.

Okay.

Also, I will say for performance versus durability, it also just drastically depends on where

you are at and skill level amongst all sports.

Right.

So like tennis, I'm probably a three five to four O tennis player.

And I'm not breaking strings nearly as fast as Alcorazza center.

Yeah.

Right.

Like you can give me the same string set up.

And I guarantee I won't break a string in probably months.

Yeah.

But they're going to break it in a day.

Yeah.

You know, or golf balls.

I guarantee that Scotty Sheffler is going to scuff up those balls with his with his wedges

way faster than I will just because contacts cleaner, swing is better, just everything.

So it just really depends on what level you're at on how long equipment will last.

Yeah.

So I'm very curious to say, I mean, we've already seen this a little bit.

Yeah.

I would say in my opinion, it's not so much definitive performance.

However, at least, you know, a year ago, there was a very clear preference towards some

of these Gen three paddles and they were obviously breaking quickly.

So okay, hey, you could argue that that is an example of the pros don't really care about

the longer lasting one because they think it performs better.

Now, some of that, I think to me is more about their use to it rather than it being

definitively performing better.

Like I feel like there are so many foam paddles now that are on par if not better than

a lot of different Gen three is better.

Do you think preference will obviously still play a role in that?

Yeah.

So maybe not a perfect example, but it's one you could, you could probably argue, right?

Like they break, but they don't care because they can give as many as they want.

You might care as an amateur because you have to replace it.

They do the same thing with grit.

Think about like they, they're, I know some players on tour who quite literally use a new

paddle every to every other match.

Yeah, they bring 20 to 25 paddles with them and they swap it out after each match.

Yep.

So that is, they want the highest performing paddle for each match possible.

Totally.

Last thing I guess I'll wrap this segment up with is I, I was saying this earlier about

it seems like friction is higher on the lower grip paddles, which again, various engineers

have said this for years.

I mean, even I would, I could probably think of conversations as early back as 2022, talking

to Rafa from Gearbox and he'd be like, grit doesn't matter.

We don't need it.

I'm like, well, I think it does matter.

But there is, I think it just up to a certain point with how it used to be in 2022.

It was so smooth that I feel like any amount of grit was like, it's going to be better.

But now that again, we can kind of go crazy on the grit.

Now I feel like we're, for the first time ever starting to see, oh, okay, hang on, things

like friction are actually going down with this much grit.

Well, so many consumers are so used to just touching the face and going, is there grit?

Ah, grit good.

But I wonder if it's going to swing back at some point where people start going, well,

wait, this paddle actually is really rough, but I'm actually not getting as much spin as

like a slightly smoother paddle that I used to have.

I'm not talking ultra smooth.

I'm not talking zero grit.

You know, I feel like people view this very black and white.

It's either no grit in its smoothness glass or it's ultra rough.

And I'm like, there's a big middle area here that is being overlooked.

Trying to think, what other sport is there a piece of equipment where people will

grab from someone, just touch it and immediately cancel it out like from like, nope, I don't

even want to use it.

Just off of a feel thing, like touching it.

I do wonder what other sports are like that.

I don't know enough about various sports to see that, but it's got to exist in some

time.

I'm trying to think there's, there's got to be some other people tennis maybe with like

how like much your hand sticks to it.

Yes and no.

I don't know.

There's got to be something very similar, but I can't think of anything.

Like can you imagine someone touching a tennis racket, they're putting their hand over

the string and they're like, nah, right.

Forget this.

I mean, maybe like, nah, but then touch, I don't know.

It doesn't, if you guys can think of anything comment it below because right now my brain,

I just can't.

Yeah, that's a funny one.

Yeah, my prediction is it's going to be a bit before all the grit conversation solved.

I think, yeah, I think at least another year is my guess.

People have good stuff in the meantime.

I'm not talking about it's bad, but I think it's going to continue to advance.

Yeah, until it's an industry wide thing, it's going to be a while.

Yeah.

There will only be a handful of brands that are doing it well for the first few years.

Yep, first year.

Yep.

So all right, let's move on to some paddle stuff here.

So first thing I just want to talk about, I saw Pickleball Central was doing a sale on

Pro4's.

I think this might actually be the lowest price that I've ever seen.

Like former flagship models of Yolas, but the Pro4's, I think there's only a handful

of shapes left.

It was like, don't quote me on this, but it was like Perseus, Hyperion, Scorpius, and

then in varying thicknesses, there might have, might have even been a magnus.

I'm not sure, but anyways, I'll leave it linked down below, but they're down to like 150.

150 for a Pro4.

Great deal, my opinion.

That's crazy.

Like I do think there are a lot of other paddles to consider, especially with longer lasting

grip, but if you're someone who likes Yolas, you didn't really like the Pro5, but I'd

be loading up on those Pro4's.

Bro, the more I just, it's so funny, I like it Yola and different paddle brands, like

tech brands.

Okay.

Like Yola is like the apple of the industry.

And it's like, yeah, you don't need the new iPhone.

You don't need the 18 Pro.

Yeah, you don't need the duo.

You go back to 17.

Yeah, just go by last year's.

It's like half off, you know, that's a funny point.

It's like, dude, 150 for if you really like Yola and want to gen 3, then dude, 150 is

pretty good deal.

And to me, again, I mean, I think I, we've talked about this.

I feel like there were the Pro4 to Pro5 was probably one of the first Yola paddles where

there was a much bigger debate about like, you like the Pro5, or do you like the Pro4

more?

Usually in the past, it was the newest one was always, oh, this is better.

Clearly better.

So again, good sale.

I don't know how long it's going to last.

There were, like I said, there were a number of them that were already sold out.

So probably I'm guessing it probably won't last even like another week.

But yeah, just thought I mentioned it because I thought that was a pretty good deal.

And pretty low price for what I've seen Yola's historically.

Yeah.

So, okay, let's move on to the Yola FX because more information got dropped on that.

So it is now confirmed $180 price point.

And then the build is a propulsion core diving board foam.

Probably everyone could have predicted that considering the propulsion core is kind of

their thing.

And then it's an EPP foam core center.

And then looking at the website, like that's about as clear as it got.

The image that they show was a little vague to me, but it almost looks like they have the

full, you know, thermoform wrapped ring, like that foam goes all the way around.

I wouldn't say that's necessarily new for them either, but they continued with that.

And then it's also only coming in the per se ashape, at least from what's on the website.

And I get that.

I'll be great.

Get that, Sam.

I'm not saying anything.

I'm not saying anything.

But so seeing this, I would say not really a lot of surprises there.

Again, they didn't have the durable grit, at least that didn't, if it is on it, they

didn't mention it.

Yep.

But again, a highly doubt they're doing that at 180.

There's no way.

They're putting that on their non-flag shit paddle.

Yeah.

You know, that makes sense.

I think it's funny.

I feel like Yola will often, people were probably going to go, oh, why didn't they put

the durable grit option on this?

What is interesting to me is Yola follows what like every other industry in the world does,

which is, hey, our flagship product, that's the only one that gets flagship item.

And you're going to pay flagship price.

But people have gotten so used to so many companies going, oh, here's a durable grit at $99.

So now everyone expects like, well, why doesn't their mid-tier item have the best features?

You know, it's a very, not a lot of other industries are like that.

If you pay less, you're usually getting something a little bit worse.

Right.

When it comes to at least mainstay price.

It just doesn't make sense.

Then dropping a foam paddle like this, this construction, and this price because when we

were at Yola for the Pro 5 launch, we were asking them questions.

And I was like, okay, when are you guys thinking about dropping a foam paddle, blah, blah?

And their answer was, well, Yola is kind of the innovators of the industry.

Gosh, I can't talk this morning.

And unless they can innovate on foam, they don't want to make it.

And I'm like, okay, what are you innovating with this?

Yeah.

There is nothing new here.

Like, okay, the thriving night, right?

That's a diving board style foam core.

So I wonder, are they listed in Yola's lawsuit?

They weren't, but I can't remember who I was talking to a while ago, but they pointed

out, if I'm recalling correctly, all of the brands that were listed were all brands that

have pros that play PPA.

So it seemed like maybe highest priority was go after the ones impacting tour.

Yeah.

So I'm like, okay, it's nothing that special or new.

So what's, what's, what are you innovating?

I had the same thought when I looked at it.

It just, I mean, they said that about it.

It's like, you know, we don't want to just do foam like everyone else.

Like if we want to do foam, we want to, you know, make a bigger entrance.

So to me, I'm like, what's the entrance here?

So my, my theory is, let's, let's just say this performs just as good as the thriving

night plays just like a thriving night.

The only way that this paddle does not eat into their flagship sales is by them marketing

it in a way to people that aren't nerds like us to put it down and below their flagship

paddle.

That is the only way it does not absolutely cannibalize their flagship model.

Yeah, I'll be really curious to see.

I don't think they're going to do that.

Like I, the way it's been marketed so far, I don't see anything that's like, oh, it's

lesser than, you know, our pro five or, you know, whatever.

So I guess it's just going to come down to how it performs.

It'll be very interesting to see like I hope it's good.

No one wants it to be bad, right?

Right.

Like I feel like Yola, I'm saying they need a hit as if they're not like the most popular

brand in, in pickleball.

Right.

But it is reminding me to a much lesser degree of what was happening to sell Kirk for a

long time.

Like sell Kirk was just in the gutter for years.

Like I feel like every paddle they released, it was like this sucks, this sucks.

Why did you do it this way?

Why did you do this way?

Yola has not done a this sucks.

It's more a why are you falling behind is what it feels like.

Yeah.

But I feel like Yola's also like the beginning stages will happen to sell Kirk.

But what's interesting though, I think what makes it different or maybe why we're seeing

some of what we see is think how much Yola is catering to their pros.

I feel like when they release a paddle, like they're not releasing something, at least

in their flagship line, unless their pros are saying, I will use this, this is good.

Yeah.

Right.

Can you imagine if the pro five came out in every single one of their top pros that, yeah,

I'm just going to stick with the pro four.

That'd be a terrible look.

And I think just what the pros want and what either nerds want or amateurs want is just

different.

I mean, how many times have we seen this?

About one with pros just continuing to prefer Gen three and not necessarily loving phone

though that conversation's kind of not even really the case anymore.

But whatever, you know, we'll pretend that's still the case.

I feel like just who they're catering towards is different than most companies.

Like sell Kirk now, not really catering to any pros.

Sure.

You know, I mean, I can understand that point, but at the same time with a lot of the

pros that I've talked to some, some people don't necessarily see that big of a difference

in performance and just would rather stick with what they're used to.

100 times.

So it's not that like, oh, foam is worse and not good enough for pros.

It's just I'm used to this.

I'm just going to stick with it.

And it's not going to make me better.

Yeah.

And they don't need it to be more durable to get free paddles.

So but then we're still seeing tons of pros that are switching to foam.

So I don't really think there's a good argument of like, Gen three's are clearly better for

high level because pros use them.

Pro's a lot of pros are using foam.

Yeah.

So I don't know.

I mean, guess we'll see.

Like as soon as it comes out, we'll buy one and we'll try and make some content about

it.

But yeah, it was just kind of confusing.

I was maybe expecting some like newer type of tech.

But then not even I think a lot of people can get hung up on.

I actually saw this on a bread and butter post this week.

It was an Instagram post.

They were talking about like upcoming local to information.

And someone in the comments said something like, Oh, all you're doing is adding long lasting

grit and no new tech.

Like, I don't want this.

And in my mind, I'm going, if you make this with a truly better long lasting grit, that

is all the local needs to still be relevant in 2026 and probably 2027.

So I've been like, people can get hung up on.

It's almost like the iPhone.

I always laugh when people go, they didn't, they didn't change the design of it.

I'm like, well, what is the design of it matter like it?

You know, like it doesn't.

As soon as it's not a terrible design, let's just, yeah, take, you know, phones as an example.

Let's just say whatever phone company you use Samsung, Android iPhone doesn't matter.

When you, you've been using your phone for a little while and the company you use says

comes out with a new one and says, Okay, we have the forever battery.

Battery will last forever.

We didn't change anything else, but your battery will never die.

Everyone would be like, that's insane.

I'm buying that immediately.

Yeah.

Right?

Like there's not a single person that would be like, yeah, right.

I think everyone on the planet would be like, yeah, I'd love to not have to charge my

phone anymore.

Yeah.

Like if grit truly lasted forever and never lost spin, people should be like, that's

amazing.

Yeah.

So to me, like I think we're making assumptions here based on other paddles.

Like, Oh, okay.

So you just did EPP phone core.

You did a diving board phone.

We probably have a ballpark idea of how we think this paddle will play.

Who knows what they did with the facelift?

Maybe there's some interesting things there.

But I think people will immediately see that us included and go, Oh, we didn't do anything

that great.

How good could the paddle play?

But I don't think you need to do something crazy with the internals for the paddle to play

well.

I mean, look, look at the wall.

How many of these are just a full floating ring with an EPP or MPP center and how many of

them all play awesome?

Well, when phone cores started initially coming around, the more simple it was, the better

it was.

Right.

Like a lot of the apes paddles had these crazy incisions and cuts and lines and all this

weird stuff.

Didn't play better.

They didn't play better or we didn't like them as much.

But then let's just take a local very simple EPP core foam ring.

One of the best paddles we played with.

Yep.

It's like don't don't over complicate the wheel.

Yeah.

So I don't know, be interesting to see.

We got what here probably about another week until it can be purchased and unless some

local stores are going to be carrying it probably a couple more days after that before

we can actually hit it.

Yeah.

I'm curious either way.

I'm very curious to see how it plays, see what happens.

Yeah.

We'll go from there.

All right.

Let's talk about some paddles.

We actually hit this week.

So spartus.

The Spitfire.

This has probably been the number one most requested paddles since I've come back.

I don't think I've had a paddle that's been more requested than the Spitfire and I get

it.

You know, it's $100 and it's got a lot going for it.

So you started hitting the elongated last week and then I've been waiting for the wide

body to show up so we could do both at the same time.

I didn't want to make a video about the elongated.

Then I have to make a video about the wide body.

I was like, let's just do this all at once.

Yep.

So okay.

Most of you already know this since the paddles have been out for a while.

It's 109 before discount code on the wide body here.

The swing weight is 107 and the static weight is 7.8 ounces.

So very light, very maneuverable.

The same thing with the elongated.

I think our first elongated Spitfire was like a 115 swing weight.

So that's also pretty low.

So I feel like you have a lot of options to customize.

First thing I got to talk about before I let you get into your talking about the play

with the paddle.

So with all of this, these grit issues going on, I have just gotten to the point where

I'm like, we have to buy our own paddles.

We have been doing this for a while.

Like paddles here there that will just buy ourselves, which is fine.

And with all the grit stuff, I was like, I need to know I'm getting whatever the consumer

is buying.

So I've started doing that.

And so I bought another elongated Spitfire.

And this wide body was one that was sent to us.

So I want to do spin test yesterday.

And holy moly, this thing ripped spin.

I mean, the first one I tested of yours was already really good.

And if I didn't order in a elongated, I would have thought this paddle was like a

juiced, oh, they did something weird to this.

Because I was averaging 2,500 RPM with this thing with a good number of results in the

whole like with 27 body with the wide body.

I'm very curious because the surface of this does feel slightly different than mine.

But I compared it with the new elongated I got it out after the pod off to go grab mine

because this feels slightly different.

Yeah, I have to grab yours and compare a little bit.

To me, it felt the same as the one I bought.

I'm curious what I could get.

They're adding into this because it is like slightly shining and sparkly and reflective

like diamond tough.

Yeah, I'm curious as well.

Yeah, the elongated also came at 2,500.

So I think most of some of these numbers going up because I feel like for the longest

time, I averaged the like 21, 22, but I've been hitting so many serves one because of

grit testing or spin testing.

But then also before I came back from injury, there was a lot of serve stuff that I was doing

and I was kind of messing with my technique.

And I think I've just found some better ways to get spin.

So some of that I don't think is necessarily the paddle.

Some of that I think is I've just recently found ways to improve my serve, which I had

never really focused on.

But either way, I felt like I could literally swing as hard as I wanted and this ball was

not going out.

Like I was shocked at the spin I was getting from this.

Like I just like I had multiple paddles and I would test other paddles and I'm like,

okay, I'm not crazy.

Like this one's getting the spin I expect.

Spitfire's still getting the spin I expect.

Like the spin reps on this thing is crazy.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's just wild.

So anyways, I'll let you talk about it because you have a little bit more play time and

then I'll talk about my experience yesterday.

Yeah, it's funny you say that I had a drill session the other day and probably the back

half of the drill session I was just at the baseline hitting drives.

It did feel really good.

I don't know what it is.

Recently my drive just felt good with every pad I play with, but the Spitfire was very

good.

I've probably got just under 30 games on it now.

Yeah.

I've played it completely stock.

It is a little light for me.

I probably will.

I mean, I did add a weight set up.

I just haven't played any games with it yet.

I might mess around and change that up a bit.

But so far it's been good.

Sweet spot.

I've had zero complaints.

It's not the most powerful paddle on the market.

So it's not like difficult to control.

There are sometimes where trying to put the ball away can be a little bit difficult when

I'm playing outside.

It's been phenomenal.

I haven't clearly noticed a big drop off.

It's only been 25, 30 games so still early.

I'd hope not a big difference yet.

That'd be bad.

It'd be like the V-Soles all over again.

So yeah, it's been good.

I haven't really had any complaints.

It's not my favorite shape of all times.

It's kind of that shorter handle elongated.

Isn't it?

It's not the same as the pressure X.

I thought it was the same as everything else.

No, I remember the other day I was showing you.

It's like the exact same shape as the gear boxes pressure.

Not like as short as a magnus.

But not same handle length as like the...

I'm trying to think of something like a loco I feel like.

Okay.

Yeah, we have to hold those up later.

Yeah, maybe I'm wrong, but it feels a little bit shorter on the throw tape or fur to

we.

I seriously, for a hundred bucks, I have zero complaints.

This is probably one of the best hundred dollar panels I've used.

Yeah, that's pretty much, yeah, I was going to say a very similar thing.

So I have only drilled with the wide body once yesterday.

So I'm basing my current thoughts off of that.

But I will obviously continue to get more play time on this thing.

But yeah, I feel like...

So light paddles, I feel like there's always this...

Not always.

I was actually having this conversation with Justin the other day.

It's very interesting.

So obviously the shift or not the shift, the command is pretty light out of the box,

pretty low swing weight for a hybrid, pretty low static weight.

And I was like, yeah, I feel like this has some sweet spot issues.

It's not like horrible, but it's like, yeah, it's not as good as other paddles out there.

And then once you add weight, which we'll get to, it's completely fine.

But I do think there are paddles like an aero cyclone, I think the spitfire.

I feel like there was one other one that just came to mind the other day.

I mean, I feel like even the Honolulu's are pretty reasonably light, at least for swing weight.

And I don't really have any sweet spot issues.

So then I started wondering, I was like, I wonder how much of that is...

When paddles are a little bit more powerful, if you're just getting more energy return in general,

and that's why they feel better, because it feels like the power paddles that are light

never really have sweet spot issues.

And then ones that are not as powerful, but as light, the sweet spot seems to perform worse.

Because I had no issues yesterday.

I'd probably add a little bit of weight just because it's light, and I want some more plow through.

But I didn't have any issues with the sweet spot or complaints about it.

I'm very curious about people's perception with some light paddles, but not others.

You know, who knows?

So, yeah, I think very maneuverable.

I would probably classify this as low tier power out of the box.

I wouldn't call it all-court.

Yeah.

Yeah, I would agree with that.

Weight out of the box.

Low tier power.

Not all-court can hit pretty hard, but it's not underpowered at all.

No, yeah.

And I'm gonna put it on.

What's crazy is that I'd probably put it below an Omni.

You know, I think I might as well.

At least when the Omni has the M.O.I. weight on it.

Oh, yeah.

If you take the M.O.I. weight off, the Omni hits.

Then I'd be curious what the swing weight and static weight differences are between them.

If you take the M.O.I. weight off of...

Probably pretty similar.

Omni might even be a little bit lighter.

I think the Omni probably would be lighter.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's interesting.

I mean, I actually liked how the Omni felt more without weight.

Not in terms of sweet spot and stuff, but like the actual feel of how the ball hit.

Like one thing I've been noticing, I should really pick Justin's brain on this, curious

if he has any thoughts on it.

But I feel like I've noticed with a handful of paddles, whenever you add weight or a good

chunk of weight, I feel like they often end up feeling stiffer.

So this happened with...

I feel like I'm just doing the whole Volaire command segment right now.

I'm just going to save that.

But the Omni is a great example of once you put the M.O.I. weight on it, I feel like the

paddle gets a lot stiffer.

Like without the weights on it, it feels more plush, soft.

I really like how it feels.

And then once you put the weight on, I'm like, oh, it feels so like springy, so stiff,

or stiffer rather.

So I don't know what that's all about, but interesting observation recently.

So yeah, I'm very excited to play with this paddle more.

This is one of the ones, I think, as one of my first ones back, that I'm very excited

for that $100 price point, doesn't seem to have any big, like, crazy...

EPP core?

Yes.

It's interesting.

So, for the $100 paddles, my top was the EPP turbo.

Not the MPP.

Not the MPP.

Okay, I got it.

I think the MPP is fun, but I played infinitely better with the EPP.

With the EPP, yeah.

It's just how it is.

But this, if the grid actually holds up, this might take over.

It's definitely less power than the EPP turbo, but it is very nice.

I like how it plays.

I mean, I almost sometimes think even, obviously, look, we all want a paddle that has long-lasting

durable grid at $100, like that would be awesome.

But even if not, it's still $100, you know?

That's still...

Look, the EPP and MPP turbo, whenever that came out, was still a great paddle, even though

it didn't have a long-lasting grid, because it was $100.

You could buy two or three of it compared to some of the other long-lasting grits or

non-long-lasting grits, like a Pro 5 or something.

Even...

I'm very curious to see, because it seems like results have been split on this.

I feel like Lewis has put a lot of time on it, and he's like, I don't feel like mine's

lost a lot of spin.

John obviously had it in like two or three, so I'm curious to see where it lands for us,

because we'll have both of us, hopefully, with a good amount of games on this to get

data on it.

And even the third one, I might give it to another person and have them do some testing

on it, just to have even more data, right?

So yeah, early impressions, Spitfire is awesome.

I see why people like it.

Hopefully the grid is also awesome, but we don't have enough data on that to actually give

you an opinion on it yet.

But I'm really excited about it this morning.

Solid paddle.

Solid paddle.

Alright, next paddle, only you are going to have some thoughts?

Yeah, you haven't hit this.

Yeah, yesterday when I was hitting the Spitfire, since you had already hit the Spitfire, I figured

you should hit the Inferno 2, so you compared this to the regular for about an hour.

I've got nothing to contribute to this conversation.

Yeah.

I'm sorry, price 239 before code, swing weight 119 static weight 7.9.

That's good.

I got nice.

Yeah, so I hit it side by side with an original Inferno, and it is very interesting.

I'm sure the core design, everything is said the same.

They've added, you know, whatever they are, marketing term, blah, blah, blah, grit is

on it.

Arrow black surface.

Yeah.

Right on there.

I have these all these silly names for different grit textures.

It feels so drastically different than a normal Inferno.

I wouldn't even call them the same paddle.

If you blacked out both paddles and had me play with them, I'd be like, these are two

different paddles, which obviously it has changed different surface, but the core feels

very different.

So the Inferno, we all know very thonky, very hollow, almost kind of like plush hollow,

just boomy, right?

And very springy.

This is very stiff and hollow.

Not like trying to think of what is like the Friday or a pro is very stiff, very hollow.

Maybe not quite as stiff as an or a pro, but it's on the stiff first side.

Sound very different.

I mean, we haven't tested it long enough to know if this grit texture is actually going

to last super long, but playing with it side by side, I had no issues generating spin

from the baseline.

Hands felt good.

I'm trying to decide what I would prefer feel wise to use because I've played qualifiers

with the Inferno and I really like it, but it can get a little squirrely sometimes.

And like that's the downside of the more soft and hollow paddles is resets get tougher.

Like you can hit the ball harder, but it's just just more squirrely.

This is probably going to be a little bit easier like drives it was easier to keep him

play.

It's tough.

I was hoping, sorry to cut you off there.

I was hoping John would have an x ray in his database of the Inferno 2, but he doesn't

yet because I try looking at lus is marketing and it doesn't it doesn't have anything.

So yeah, solid paddle is just if you if you play with an inferno and think, okay, I want

a better grit texture.

I'm going to buy this one.

Be prepared for it to be like a very different paddle.

Yeah, it's it's not the same.

But otherwise, I think it's good.

It's expensive for sure.

But I think it plays, plays well.

I like it still very like very high on the power scale.

Here's the question.

Now, which would you take between the two?

That's what I was just trying to figure out.

Because is there something you think one is better for over the other or is it just purely

a feel thing?

It's purely a feel thing.

I just think what like I almost think this one, if you are okay with the stiff feeling,

this is going to be slightly easier to control in my opinion.

I could probably see that I'm guessing just without even hitting it based on what you're

describing that I am probably the person that the inferno two would be easier to use for

because the the first inferno I was the type of player who just had such a hard time controlling

it.

I know you struggle with it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So yeah, it's tough.

It's just don't expect it to be a typical inferno.

I think it's good.

Yeah.

It's good with it, no complaints, but it's not the same.

It is different.

Which I mean, you would hope if it's called in inferno two, I hope it's different in some

way.

Right.

But if you really like the feeling of the original inferno that really hollow, thonky,

poppy feel, but then just wanted a better grit texture, a more durable grit texture because

Luz has had very bad track record on Peelply.

They're like, they just had bad track record with grit every time they come out with a new

type of grit.

At least according to John, it's not good.

Grit in general.

Yeah.

But like the original infernos, bro, I was cooking through those things very fast.

Yeah.

Like those things lost spin crazy fast.

So yeah, we'll see how we will put more testing on this and see see if it lasts any longer.

But and it's fine.

I just think there's definitely getting better for cheaper now.

I think if I had to choose between a spitfire in this or two spitfires in this, I'm probably

taking the spitfire.

Yeah.

As the thing is, we're at an interesting era in pickleball where I feel like following

up the previous paddle with the same name is going to be really hard.

Like everyone really liked the inferno.

So that in my opinion, like take the loco to for example, if it is literally just a regular

loco with a longer lasting grit that actually lasts, like I said before, awesome.

That's all it needed.

It didn't need more.

I feel like similarly with the inferno, it was so popular that all it needed was a better

real long lasting grit.

And then that is good enough.

But I feel like if you change feel a lot, it's really hard because what are we making better

at this point?

The sweet spot on the inferno was already good.

A lot of people already like the field profile.

Maybe it was a little heavy, but that can always be a good or a bad thing depending on who

you are as a player.

Following up the original inferno to a two is not easy.

Like you know what?

I think it will probably be the all time hardest paddle to follow up in pickleball.

The boom stick.

What do you make better?

If you make a boom stick to, how do you make it better?

The only thing to me is that you change the grit to something that's actually good.

Because it already had a massive sweet spot.

They weren't heavy.

Well, it's the non flashy stuff.

Right?

So like things that people complain about, but don't notice until you've used it for

a while.

So yeah, grit, and a better grit texture is one.

And that's something that I think any pat like an inferno or a logo too.

I think of it purely for me.

If it just had a actual better performing durable grit, that's all it would need.

But say boom stick, a lot of people had edge guard issues.

That was a big problem.

Yeah.

So if they fix that, but that's not a flashy thing.

No one cares about that.

But until you use it for a while.

It's a thing that shouldn't even have been a problem.

You should have to think about it.

Or face layers cracking because there's only two face layers.

That was happening all the time.

A lot of people complained about that if they fix that.

But if you buy it a new version of a boom stick too, then those things don't happen.

Then in your mind, you're like, yes, just expected.

So it doesn't feel like anything changed.

And I think let's just, because feel is one of those things that you're going to make

some people happy.

You're going to make some people mad.

Someone's going to want stiff and hollow.

Someone's going to want soft and dense.

Let's just make up something here and say a boom stick too was going to be soft and dense.

You're going to piss off a lot of people that really liked the boom stick being stiff

and hollow and maybe make some of these people over here happy.

So I just feel like following up certain paddles is almost an impossible task with how good

paddles have gotten.

Kind of like, you know, with iPhones or something.

Largely, the smartphone is solved and good.

Yes, there are things you can continue to improve, cameras, battery, whatever.

But those aren't things that make people go, oh my gosh, that is awesome.

We're talking about an extra hour of battery.

Cool.

The new iPhone has an aperture blade like, and you just can't please everybody.

The feel thing is you just have different camps of people and whatever you come out with

is going to please some and upset the others.

I must wonder if at some point we're going to have, I doubt it just because this is probably

way too confusing for the manufacturers.

But if you were going to do like, I'm going to make something up here like, loco soft,

loco stiff.

You would probably come up with way better names than that.

But like you have designated models of like, look, it's the same paddle, but we tweaked

one to be feel softer and one to be stiffer.

One you're going to confuse consumers.

Yes.

And two, companies are going to hate having so many skews.

Yeah, for sure.

No company wants to have that many skews.

Yeah.

So it would just be annoying for everybody.

I feel like I agree.

I agree.

So yeah, I don't know.

All that to say, I feel like following up the original inferno is kind of hard unless

you just fixed the grid.

Yeah.

For sure.

Because I mean, I don't really be at size of the grid.

I don't really think I heard people complain much about the inferno.

I feel like I only ever heard good things.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I agree.

I don't know.

All right.

Last battle we'll talk about here.

I'll be quick on this one since I feel like I already gave the rundown.

The layer command got a bunch more games this week.

I think I'm in like the 30-ish game ballpark now.

And I added weight if you're watching the pod.

This is probably going to look like a pretty significant amount of weight to you, which

I guess it is.

This is one gram per inch.

And it's about seven to seven and a half inches on both sides.

I basically have it running from the bottom of the throat up most of the side.

And this is also lead tape because I finally ran out of one gram tungsten tape.

So I feel like a caveman using lead.

I was playing with this and like my two-y, you know, I would, my finger would kind of rub

on it.

And I'm like, I'm going to die.

I'm like, lead poisoning is going to get me.

Wrong.

Unless you're eating it.

Yes, I know.

I know.

I know.

But it's just been so long.

I was like, don't touch it.

Don't touch it.

I feel like people will treat, I mean, yes, lead is a toxic material.

But I feel like some people treat it like it's uranium.

It's radio acutely.

Radio acutely.

Yeah, right.

So okay.

So that's my weight set up.

And now, like I said, a lot of you are probably going, wow, that is way too much weight,

Chris, way to ruin the paddle.

It's still not heavy.

It is 115 swing weight, which is where most hybrids start and static weight.

Okay, maybe it's a little on the higher ish end.

It's about 8.3 ounces now.

But let me go check really quick.

See if I can, can't remember if I put this back on my website.

I can go here.

Studio database.

Boomstick.

I should hit that sometime because I'm very curious to see what I think of that weight

set up.

I don't think I would dislike it, but I'm almost positive I would change it from that

set up.

I'd be curious.

I kind of feel like you'd like it.

I feel like you might.

There might be one you prefer more, but it's okay.

Real quick.

In my database, boomstick.

I think we can all agree is probably like currently one of the most popular paddles on

the market.

Yeah.

The wide body that we measured 8.5 ounces and the elongated 8.3 ounces.

So before I hear complaints, that 8.3 ounces for a paddle is too heavy.

Go tell that to all the boomstick users out there that are swinging that thing around

and loving it.

The whole static weight thing, man.

People get way too hung up on the static.

Kind of forget about static.

Omni 8.23 ounces wide body, 8.2 for the elongated.

So look, 8.3 ounces is fine.

None of you are going to die with 8.3 ounces.

We know some people that are like, if it's over 7.7, I won't even tell you to break

my arm.

And I'm like, you stop.

Don't do this.

So yes, not that heavy.

And playing with it, I didn't, I wasn't like, oh my gosh, not maneuverable.

Like I had no complaints.

115 is still pretty reasonable.

It just starts very light.

So anyways, pretty much fixed all the issues I had with it.

I still, the only thing I haven't gotten to do yet is play some competitive games at

my level.

So I have drilled with this now with this weight setup.

And then I have, I did play a bunch of games one evening, but it was at an event at a

facility.

So the level of play was kind of all over.

It was, you know, a mix of three, five up to about four, five and a lot of just mixing

in of different levels.

So play was kind of all over.

So maybe not the best example of, you know, maybe I wouldn't have had a sweet spot complaint

when it was stock because I'm just receiving an easier ball than I'm used to.

But so far, every complaint I had about the sweet spot is gone now.

Like it feels manageable, feels solid.

The only thing, like I was saying about the spitfire and other paddles with adding weight

is that the softer, more hollow feel that it had, I feel like now it is stiffer.

And so I feel like I'm losing out on some of that I liked that softer feel.

It's not completely gone.

But I was like, hmm, wonderful off to change the weights that up at all to bring that back.

Because to me, that is one of the more, have you always preferred softer feeling paddles?

No.

I wouldn't even say it's, I have a strict preference.

I feel like I just kind of bounce around and depending on the paddle.

Like for example, the loco, pretty darn stiff, I would say.

I also, the Oro Pro I think is really good.

Also a stiff paddle.

But there are just certain paddles where I think, I think I like the feedback of softer

more, but I will get over it if I feel like the performance of a stiffer paddle is fine.

Yeah.

So when I hit a soft one, I'm like, ooh, I really like how this feels.

I'm just trying to think because I feel like we've flipped flopped on our preferences.

Yeah, I feel like it does.

Because I was in the soft and hollow camp as Thonky as possible and now I'm leaning more

towards stiff and hollow.

Like the planets orbiting, we just keep trying to try to exercise.

Yeah.

So yeah, I'm pretty pleased with where this is at.

I think we'll see a probably only need maybe another like 20, 30 games to really feel

like I know this paddle and kind of where it sits.

But I think after the wait, the Coal Pro is probably going to be the things biggest competitor.

I feel like they are fire power wise, not far from each other.

I think there will probably be some subtle differences.

Maybe one has a little bit more pop or one has a little bit more power.

But I feel like it's really going to come down to which performs better.

The UPA diamond tough, which we haven't gotten to test yet.

I'm kind of just basing everything off of what John has said about it.

I know for him, it was performed really well on the cannon and X-Grid.

Like I feel like that's what it's going to come down to because once this is as

weight, I feel like it's much more on the realm of a Coal Pro than it was initially.

So that's kind of where I'm sitting with it right now.

Not a paddle that I think is going to absolutely blow your mind like price difference between

this and a Coal Pro.

Coal Pro, if memory serves me right, is 220 before a code and this is 180 before a code.

So after code, it's probably 160 versus 200.

So that could play a factor in that as well.

I mean, $40 is a pretty noticeable difference.

But you know, Coal Pro has three shapes.

This currently has one shape.

And this is also a pre-order and the Coal Pro is not.

So yeah, more time to kind of narrow that down.

But it's not going to be like a boom stick where everyone picks this up and is like, oh my

gosh, this is the most fun paddle ever.

It's like, I think it's biggest claim to fame right now is that it has X-Grid and sits

somewhere between a jelly bean and a power two.

So it fills a spot that a X-Grid paddle didn't have and a slightly cheaper price one.

That is kind of what I think is making this more compelling.

So yeah, that's what I have to say about this so far.

But yeah, pretty good paddle.

All right.

I liked playing with it the other night.

I was having a good time with it.

Yeah.

And even the games I played last week actually was playing some great pickable last week.

I was like, man, I maybe I'm back.

Maybe after now that I've started hitting again, I'm telling you guys when I first started

getting back into this, the first tournament I played, man, would that have been like a

month ago now?

Maybe like I'm almost a month and a half ago or something.

I was like, I am so washed.

I'm so bad at pickable.

I was like, I cannot believe I'm this bad now.

So it feels good to maybe suck a little less.

Okay.

Man, you know, it's funny.

I didn't say it at the beginning of this pod.

But as I was making this pod, I was like, man, it's going to be like a 40 minute pod this

morning and then it ends up.

When you texted me that and you're like, or we were talking the other day and you're

like, yeah, we're going to have to scrounge up for a decent length pod.

I'm like, no, we don't know.

Maybe you know, maybe we'll do like how long do you think we're at right now?

What do you think?

Uh, Cameron's not really saying what does this say?

I can't read it from here.

It's an hour hour and an hour.

All right.

We're just going to go straight to Q&A and we're going to save that topic for next week

in case because I bet you next week we're going to meet it.

Well, that or if we talk about this, this week could be on an hour for this topic alone.

Exactly.

That's why I'm like, we'll save it.

Sometimes guys, there are weeks where coming up with a whole pod is not an easy task.

There are definitely weeks where it's like, man, what are we going to talk about this

week?

Sometimes nothing happens in the pickup on the street and it's just slow.

And other times there's too much.

Yeah.

All right.

We're going to jump to some Q&A and we'll save the paddle review process for next week.

All right.

First one, I guess this question is kind of already answered if you listen to this segment.

Have you hit the YOLF X?

Nope.

Not yet.

But as soon as we have hit it, we'll let you know.

This one I think will be an interesting one.

The Franklin ball with the Franklin ball coming out will ever place lifetime.

So I had you bring a Franklin ball to a group and you told me that.

So I'll hold on before you say that.

Okay.

My answer is going to be potentially and also know because amongst at least here in

Minnesota high level people and this is common amongst every group, every state, every

person I've played with in high level groups are all stubborn as Frick, man.

Yes.

And no one wants to use or try anything different.

I actually don't even think that is a high level thing.

I mean, think about the amount of people.

I mean, my wife having worked at a facility, she would tell me all the time how picky people

would be like, no, it needs to be a diet.

People are so picky.

They're so picky about it.

So like one, let me just give my opinion on the difference between them.

Now let me preface this with we don't have a ball yet that has reached full breaking.

It's whole breaking crap.

I know, but I'm just saying that is important because a fresh lifetime ball versus a used

one, very different.

No, we compare it when I was at that group, we use a brand new lifetime ball played with

a brand new lifetime ball and then use this.

Okay.

So let's just start with color.

Franklin, 12 million times better than lifetime is the most garbage color ball I've ever seen

in my life and I will die on that hill.

I don't care what anyone says.

I do think everyone agrees with you on that.

Die on that hill.

I've never heard someone disagree except maybe me.

I'm neutral.

Franklin is so much better in color.

Now, the Franklin ball bounces like a bouncy ball.

This thing about if you thought that when we got introduced to the lifetime ball, thought

it bounced high, bro, Franklin, what's it to shame?

The first game we played, it was just everyone was ripping this thing because it is so fast

with the paddles we have now.

So like wasn't even fun.

And one guy kept complaining is like, it's impossible to hit a drop and I'm like, no,

it's not.

You just want to keep ripping drives.

Sure.

So everyone's complaint was it's too fast.

It's hard to reset.

It bounces too high and I got like two games out of people and they refuse to use it anymore.

So I unfortunately was not able to get much testing time on it because no one wanted

to use it.

You and I are going to have to do some drill sessions at some point.

It's kind of tough just because we're in the middle of testing paddles and you don't

want to change the ball as a variable in the middle.

But you and I really need to just take one ball and play with it for a handful of drill

sessions where that's like our only ball to break it in and then compare it to a used

one because I'm very curious once it's because I mean, everyone said the same thing about

the lifetime last year, right?

Like I mean, I'm the same way.

When a lifetime is brand new, if I go to a tournament, the first thing I tell people

if we are handed new lifetime balls, I look at my opponent and I say, I've got a used

one in my bag.

Would you rather use that?

I've never had someone tell me no brand new lifetime ball is not that bad.

I would much prefer a new one over a used one.

No, it's so fast.

That is the point.

All day long gives me a new one over used.

That is how they are initially intended to be used.

No, no, no, no, no.

Okay, when you go to the store, if you're marathon, do you want me to give you a pair of shoes

that have been run 200 miles in number?

Do you want brand new shoes?

No, but the difference is I think the lifetime ball is past what we want when it's new and

then when it's used, it's like, this is a normal ball.

Get used to how it's supposed to be.

I don't like it.

I mean, I've gotten used to the ball.

I don't like it, but that's just how it is.

Get used to it.

So my prediction is without having gotten to play the Franklin, you know, broken in.

So taking performance aside, I think Franklin probably has a very much higher likelihood

of penetrating the mass market with this ball because one, there's so many people.

I'm still willing to bet you the Franklin X40 is the most popular ball across the nation.

Agreed.

As a ball.

So Franklin releases a new ball.

People are more likely to try it.

Hey, this one doesn't crack as often.

Let's start using that because they last longer, you know, so I think it'll be interesting

to see what the divide is.

I think you think the US open will switch to this.

Oh, that'd be really interesting.

Yeah, I feel like I heard the APP switching to this ball, the new Franklin.

Yeah, the new Franklin.

Okay.

Yeah, I mean, that'd be interesting to see because I feel like the regular X40 is so slow

it.

Yeah, I was going to say out in the heat.

It's sort of.

It probably, you'd probably be loving it.

Yeah.

But I think people like you or I who play a lot of PPA tournaments or depending on what

the local tournaments do, will continue to use the lifetime ball unless all those tournaments

start switching to the Franklin because we're already used to it.

It's what we use for work.

It's what we use for PPA tournaments.

So there's not a real incentive for us to switch.

But if you take regular amateurs who maybe aren't playing tournaments as much, okay,

lifetime ball has been kind of hard to get.

I already know this brand Franklin.

I like their other ball.

Let me just use that.

So I kind of feel like there's going to be a big split between the lifetime and the Franklin

come maybe next year.

And when this ball is officially out because I don't think it's officially out yet.

I don't see many higher level groups switching.

Yeah, I would agree with that.

People are just stubborn.

Okay.

How is the Yola Pro 5 durability now that they've been out longer?

So I think there's two things that kind of go hand in hand with this.

Then I, we've said this before, I just don't see as many Pro 5.

So it's like, okay, am I seeing the issue less because there are less of them in the wild?

Or are they actually better?

It's probably a mix of both because honestly, I feel like with the Pro 4, I still heard

a lot of complaints.

The Pro 5, I really, yes, people have core crush on them obviously.

But I don't feel like I hear about it nearly at the same rate.

So the stuff they were talking about to try and, you know, the little seed at the top.

The reason why I don't, I mean.

The people I do hear from are lifetime employees who get them for free and use them.

And they'll probably core crush on Agent 3.

They usually coaches.

Yeah, they're still core crushing them.

Or some sign players.

The people, I just, you don't hear it as much because they don't buy them and the market

has gotten so much more flooded with good paddles.

They're like, okay, why am I going to spend $300 when I can get a good $100 paddle?

Yep.

There was one guy who was a die hard goal of hand.

He would only use Pro 4 or Agent 3 like that was his favorite paddles.

He doesn't even use them anymore.

Yeah.

So I just, I feel like it is a big part of his because there's less of them.

Yeah, hard to say, but yeah, I really don't hear much complain at this point.

So if you have, if you use a lot of Pro 5s, let us know down in the comment because it's

been out for a bit now.

So, you know, there should be enough people.

If you've been meaning it for a while, we'll hear about it.

Yeah.

All right.

Next one.

What are your main paddles?

Go ahead.

You can start.

I just like don't really have a main right now.

I'm just in swapping between everything.

But if I had to pick, I'd say or a Pro.

Okay.

I also don't really have one right now because I've been waiting, you know, to get through

this slew of paddles to make sure like, oh, hey, maybe there's one I really like that.

I haven't gotten to test yet.

So I don't really have one.

I still really like the Spartus P1, the first tournament back that I played.

I played with the wide body of that and I was really vibing with it.

So I guess if I had, if you told me right after this podcast, I'm going to a tournament,

I'll probably just bring that.

But I also feel like I could probably bring a handful of paddles and be fine.

Yeah.

Like, here's the thing.

The life of a paddle reviewer is there is no main because you're constantly going to

another paddle.

Yeah.

You know, like last year.

The local I would say was definitively my main because I used it for so long and for

chasing 50.

But like, if I'm in a heavy paddle reviewing season, there's no such thing as a main.

If I'm playing pickleball, I'm playing pickleball for work.

I don't really get to play pickleball for my own.

Just pure enjoyment that often anymore.

So it's like, okay, if I'm going to be on court, I should probably be testing something.

Yep.

So that's my answer.

Next one.

Should I buy the same paddle when mine wears out?

So I give this question a lot.

Yes.

A lot of people though, like, hey, so my paddle wear out wore out.

And then my first, you know, should I buy a new one?

I like, what should I do?

Get a different paddle or buy the same one?

And I always go, did you like the paddle?

I'm like, oh, I loved it.

I'm like, then yes.

Buy the same one because unless you're in the gear and you just like trying paddles,

which is also cool too, right?

That's like why we like this job.

You should just stick with the same one.

It'll be way better for your game.

Dude, it gives question all the time.

It's like, yeah, my paddle is wearing out.

Should I buy something new or should I stick with this?

I want to try these.

Do you think it compares?

And I'm like, if you like this, just stick with it.

There's no reason to switch.

Especially if you don't have a big complaint.

Yeah.

You know, if you told me, man, I just hate the handle length on this thing.

It like really drives me nuts a bit.

Okay, well, maybe let's consider some new options.

But if you tell me you like 85 to 90% of that paddle, just stick with it.

Yeah.

For sure better for your game.

I mean, one of the best times of my pickable career was last year during the Chasing

5.0 series, where I, for the most part, only got to play with like one paddle for a pretty

long stretch of time.

And I was like, wow, so much easier to not switch paddles.

It's so much better for your game when you can just get used to a paddle.

Yeah.

You know?

So, yeah, stick with one.

Paddles for people who want all court to control with durable grit.

Currently it seems like there are only, I would say, about two good options.

Sounds like the Coral Pro.

Again, we haven't put that through our own testing.

So take that for what it's worth, but it sounds like it's been good for everyone else.

And then the 11624 Jelly Bean 2.

Jelly Bean 2 being the control side and the Coral Pro being on the all court side.

Yeah, those are pretty much your only options.

And both seem to be great.

So yeah, pick whichever one depending on we have, we've reviewed the Jelly Bean 2 but

not the Coral Pro.

But there should be plenty of the Coral Pro, I'm sure, other reviews at this point.

How much time do you spend testing paddles versus your main?

Well, I guess I actually just answered that question.

Yeah, there's like 0% time spent on a main.

Like, I'll tell you what.

Testing is infinite.

The only time a main starts getting picked up for me is when I'm like in the week of

a tournament and I'm like, okay, I should probably lock in a little bit and not suck at this

tournament.

That's when my main is getting used.

And then at the tournament.

Yep.

Yeah, probably the same thing for you.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Sorry.

I was just like, I thought I said, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Totally.

I was like, hello.

Okay.

Kind of answered this one earlier as well.

But how long for these durable grit issues to get resolved?

It kind of depends what you want to consider resolved, right?

Like, ones like Hex grit and Permagrit, potentially six zeros, UPA diamond tough are performing

well.

I just think there are other companies that haven't figured it out and it's going to

take them a while.

Do you think resolved means like industry wide?

It's like every company has it.

Yeah.

I've been my guest based on how they phrased this is more, are we going to stop having like

a controversy like the V soul tour or the Apes?

Like when is that going to stop?

It's like on one hand.

Look at how fast technology spreads across the industry.

Yeah.

Like a year ago, we had only a couple foam paddles.

Every company now has foam pad.

So within a year, it is industry wide.

That pretty much every company has a pretty good foam paddle.

But grit obviously is a little bit different.

I think in my opinion, it's probably a little bit more difficult to quote unquote, perfect.

So a minimum of a year.

Yeah.

That's kind of my guess.

I think before it's really widespread and I would say you get to a point where you don't

really have to question as much.

Yep.

Who has a durable grid and who doesn't.

But we'll revisit that in a year and see where we're at.

But I hope it gets yourself, because man, it is so weeding through all the marketing

and whether it's actually long lasting and then doing all the play testing and then people

are getting different results.

And it's like, what is happening here?

It's a lot.

It is a lot.

Last question.

Best way to break into higher level groups.

So I bet you, you and I will have very different answers for this question.

This is a really tough one.

I get this question a lot.

It's a tough one.

Do you want me to go first to you?

That's your yours.

Okay.

So I feel like I had a kind of a unique entry into higher level groups because I feel like

I got invited to much better groups than I should have been invited to.

Very early in pickleball.

Wait, that still doesn't happen?

Hey bro.

Chill.

Chill.

Well, with how long I was gone, all our friends might have forgot about me.

I don't know who I am anymore.

But initially, I started out as like a three five and we pretty quickly got connected

with four, five and five o level players.

But there was a number of reasons that it happened for me slash us is when I got in, I could

do a lot of photo work.

So there were just random people I connected with and pickleball like, hey, I could shoot

some photos for you.

It'd be nice to get to know you or whatever.

And they just happened to be higher level people.

And then they just enjoyed being around me.

So they're like, oh, hey, come play.

I also feel like pickleball at that time was a little bit better about including different

levels of play than it is now.

I feel like people are a lot more particular today about how they want their games to look.

So I think it was a slightly different era.

But I think people just ended up liking me as a person and they're like, hey, come play.

Maybe you can play with some of the slightly lower level people and you can play a game

or two with like the four or five's because I'd get my butt absolutely handed to me.

So I feel like being a pleasant person, I'm going to say is 85 to 90% of the work.

If you're a great player and everyone hates being around you, you're not getting invited

and someone wants to play with you.

So be a good person who is nice, interested in other people, not like this.

Oh, I'm interested in you because I want to get in your group is like, you're genuinely

interested in the person.

I feel like that's kind of what happened with me.

So I feel like I kind of got lucky there.

And then, you know, obviously I kept getting better.

So then that made it easier to play in different groups because now it was, oh, the skills

not an issue.

It's now the skills there and we like you as a person.

Yeah.

So that's kind of my answer.

I might have a slightly different answer here in a second, but I'm curious to see what

you say.

Yeah, it's tough.

Depending on what your public court situation looks like or maybe the facility you play

at, it can be very tricky because obviously the higher.

Level groups, it kind of depends what are we qualifying as high level because high, you

know, if you're a three five four five is higher level to you.

I mean, we just go in here for five five five.

I feel like even from three five to four five or four five to five.

Oh, are different groups and different dynamics.

Yeah, you're right.

Like, there's a much broader range of four fives.

And so it's probably easier to get in groups with them if you're lower.

But if you're four five, there's a lot less five o's and it's going much more tight

knit and a little bit more difficult to get in.

But what I would say is if you have a public court system and people do, let's say like

a weekly challenge court thing, like you said, above all, maybe not above all, but very

high up there.

I would say above all is attitude.

Yeah.

Like if you are just a friendly, nice person that people will enjoy talking with off court

and you're not crashing out throwing your paddle, cussing, like not doing those things.

People don't mind dropping level play a little bit.

That's totally fine.

Myself included totally fine with that.

But also when you do get an invite or you go on to a challenge court, you get it onto

those courts into a game with those people.

That is you have to look at that as a test.

Yeah.

And you have to accept the fact that you're either going to pass or fail.

Yeah.

And if you pass, you'll get invited to another game.

And if you fail, you might not be able to come back for a little bit and you just need

to work and get a little bit better so you can like that's happened.

There were times where I got invited to a group, probably shouldn't have been there, didn't

play my best, and I didn't come back for a week or two.

And maybe I had a friend who had a pity invite, you know, and it was like, hey, sorry guys,

I'm bringing this guy along.

Yeah.

You know, but like me, yeah, it is, it is a test.

And you just have to accept you that did well or did not.

Yeah.

And you just have to work better so you can kind of keep up with those people or ask one

guy who's maybe slightly above you and kind of in those groups to just drill.

Yeah.

And if you can drill with those guys, because like drilling at a gap level is not that bad

sometimes.

Yeah.

And so if you can see, I like you drill with me and I'm so much better than you.

That's crazy.

That's wild.

How did your qualifier go?

It was great.

Your first qualifier.

Great.

We drew a really tough match.

Oh, and out.

You know, I'm about the same record as Zane these days, you know.

That's crazy.

I don't know.

Zane seems like he's playing the first day and then just headed home.

So I'm about as good as so true.

So true.

But yeah, it's, yeah, that's, that's kind of just how it is with high love groups.

And if there's like, like I said, with a weekly challenge court, don't be the person

who is like hawking the court to like trying to get like jump in immediately a game is over

because people will just kind of wait and go out and not like if you're like really

desperate to try and play with them, it's going to be a lot harder for you to get on

courts.

You just have to kind of be like, Hey, like can I play a game with you guys?

See how it goes.

Also, I think there's a lot of the challenge court thing you said is great, which you know,

it's very in very limited scenarios exists in Minnesota, but largely we don't really do

that here, which I am actually bummed about.

I wish it was a bigger thing in our public parks.

I think it would actually be great for the kind of ecosystem of pickable.

But if you are in a state that does that, I mean, one, you can just get in the games because

okay, you can probably just set your paddle down and get a chance to play with these people.

But also, I think there are other ways, you know, we have a lot of indoor facilities.

So if you have a lot of facilities in your area, it might be, are there different types

of open plays or events at that facility where it is you are able to play up a little

bit.

You know, if you're a three five trying to go to a four five open play, that's probably

not going to work because a lot of times they're duper gated.

I was going to say that's usually the problem.

But if you're able to bump up just a little bit at a time, that is the way that I feel

like, you know, as you improve people usually take notice.

Like there have been a lot of people in Minnesota that maybe they didn't start awesome and

I would see them in a tournament, but I would every tournament.

I'm like, Oh, okay.

They got beat pretty bad last time.

Now they got bronze.

Oh, hey, they got gold this tournament.

Oh, hey, now they're going up a level.

I feel like people just noticed that.

So to me, the best way is just get better at pickleball.

You know, drill.

Just play more.

Like I wouldn't focus so much on like, I need to think of all these techniques to try and

get on the court.

It's like being a nice person and also just getting better at pickleball helps.

Oh, and if you are, this is a big one.

And I cannot believe this didn't pop in my mind immediately.

I'm curious to see what you say here.

If you are on a court with three people that you know you are the worst person there,

or you know you're much lower than your partner, do not try to be a hero.

Do not try and do crazy things and impress everyone on the court because it's not going

to work.

Like I have had people jump on a court with two other guys in myself, someone who's a

little bit lower than all of us and is on the right side and tries to take every ball

on the middle, smacking my paddle.

Well, I'm trying to take a dink in the middle.

Like you are not that guy.

This is not your time to try and show off and take every ball in the middle.

Like you're just annoying me, right?

I never experienced that.

Like that has been my experience sometimes when they get like, say a four or four or

five in my group and they just trying rush the middle, take every ball with their back

hand.

They like are smacking my paddle while I'm trying to take an overhead.

They're like practically pushing me off the court because I think they're trying

to almost prove themselves.

Like that is just not the time.

It's not necessary.

Like you're just kind of annoying people if you do that.

So kind of be aware of your surroundings as well.

Not the time to try and be here.

I just said I've never experienced that and then I immediately thought, wait, if I've

never experienced that, does that mean I'm that guy?

I'm that guy.

I'm that guy.

I'm the guy taking all the balls and people like, Chris, stop it.

And maybe that's not like always the case when someone lowers with higher level people,

but that has been my experience with some groups where like a lower level guy is on my

team and it's just like, Clank and Paddle is taking balls and the bell pushing me off

the court.

You know what we forgot and even bigger one.

This is kind of the reverse of what you just said, but let's say you have a higher level

guy that does want to mix in, but then it's three people who are silo.

Yeah.

Do not ice out the higher level guy.

This happens.

I mean, at any level, I have even had my wife, who is probably about a three, seven,

five to four, oh, if she's played some open plays where she'll mix down for work and

then tell me stories of like, dude, no one would hit me the ball.

Yeah.

And like, I don't want to play if you're not going to hit me the ball because a lot of

times when people do is they get in those games and they go, I got to win this game so

I can tell my friends I won that game.

If you're just hitting to their weaker partner and ignoring them, you didn't win that game.

Yeah.

For sure, you won the game, but you didn't beat that person.

You beat the other guy.

There's a reason why there's a facility here locally that I used to go to these

like five open plays and sometimes there'd be like legitimately good groups of people,

but it is just impossible to keep high level people and open play group because lower level

people leak in, they let people in and then stuff like that happens where there was a

there was a guy who I got in a group where there was two or two better players were on

opposite teams and then the two little bit lower guys and it was like skinny singles.

And I'm not in a tournament competitive mode.

I'm not going to be poaching balls in an open play.

I'm not here to try and absolutely mess people up.

So their goal was like, I'm going to beat this other person and they literally would brag

to others like, I beat Isaac in a game.

I'm like, you beat my partner.

Yeah.

You did not beat me.

So it's like, don't do that if a high level guy gets in your like group.

Don't ice them out.

They just want to play pick up off.

They're not there to destroy you.

And maybe there's the occasional jerk.

That would like mix in with lower people and just poach everything and try and, you know,

mess you up.

That's not usually the case.

But also it's like, you know, if you really are trying to get better, that is your time

to go, what do I need to work on?

Like we've had times where we've, I mean, a great example last year, Tyra happened

to be in the area and we got some games with her.

So you and her played and then me and I played together against you guys.

And I mean, I was hitting balls to you that made sense.

But my objective was, I'm going to feed Tyra as many balls because I can't play with

Tyra every day.

Yeah.

Like I would, you know, mess me up, like hit me with the ball or something.

You know, like I know what you can do.

I don't need to see how you play.

And it wasn't even about you get bagged by me every day.

So yeah, it just hit to hit to the the better player if that is an opportunity given to

because you may get to do that more often.

If it's a fun experience for them, like at the end of the day, what people care about

on the pickleball court, no, regardless of your level is just having a good time.

I really wish I had this on camera.

Funny story just popped up in my, in my memory bank.

Last year I was in a group of lower level people, like quite a bit lower, probably three

fives.

Also, I feel like we have to say this every time we're on a podcast talking about it.

It sounds so aggressive.

Well, it sounds saying lower level sounds like a just your bad at pickleball.

But I be like, the way we're using lower level is not your bad at pickleball.

It's just different.

It is a difference in level, like five, five, two, four, five is lower level.

There's nothing wrong with being lower.

It's just a separate, there's a skill gap.

We almost need a better word for this.

I know you'd be misinterpreted so badly.

We needed to put that disclaimer at the beginning of this.

Yeah, I'm going to make it this far.

But I was in a group of people with probably probably like three, five, yeah, probably

around three, five.

And I was getting iced out so bad that like the ball never ended, especially at that

big of a gap, 50 plus to three, five.

I'm not even stepping on people shoes, poaching like 100%.

That's just ridiculous.

So I thought it'd be funny to the point where I got to the kitchen, I just never saw a ball.

I literally put my paddle inside my shirt and just started watching the point.

Ball still never got hit to me.

I'm like, this is insane.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So yeah, just don't, don't be that group.

Because I used to out better people.

The other thing too is like what I was saying about everyone just wants to have fun.

You know, I went to that event a couple days ago.

And like I said, the play was all over the place.

Like, you know, there was probably people as low as three.

Oh, there was people all the way up to about like four or five, I would say maybe a little

bit of five.

Oh, here they're, I just didn't mix in with those.

And I had a great time.

Like I wasn't, it's not like it's impossible to have a good time when you're playing with

people like if you're fun on the other side of the net and we can have a good time, like

maybe there's a little bit of banter back and forth or we can all laugh about doing

something.

Yeah.

Like I would have, I had a great time and I was like, I'll keep doing this all night.

I was not even that concerned with man, where the, the five oh guys are like, I want,

you know, it might have been fun to go get a game with that group or whatever.

But I was having a great time playing with everyone out.

So as long as you're just making it fun for everyone, you know, like for example, if

I got on one of those courts and let's say one of the three fives objective was like,

I need to win this game.

And they were just throwing a tantrum every time they missed a ball.

I'd be like, yeah, I don't want to play with that guy again.

That was really awkward.

Yeah.

Like I just want to have fun.

100%.

You know, also the other thing is people ask me on time, how do I get better faster?

Play with better people.

You, like in the fastest way to improve is to get absolutely beat up because you will

just see those shots get used to that pace, get used to the angles and you'll just learn.

You will adapt.

So I have an interesting thought about that because a lot of there's a, there's a,

a certain range, you know, a three five is not going to be getting better drilling with

me going all out.

I would say half a point up.

Yes.

But even then, I agree with what you said.

I do think that is one of the fastest ways to do that.

So I don't ice them out.

Yeah.

If you want to get better, get beat up by them.

It's inevitable because you're learning like, oh my reset's kind of suck.

Yeah.

Or whatever it is.

Maybe it's some, you know, your footwork.

But I think what's also a lot of times people will overemphasize that a little bit where

sometimes I go, well, the only way I'm going to get better is if I have high level guys,

like, oh, if I can't get high level games, then I can't get better at pickable.

That's the thing.

That's right.

Yeah.

I think the main objective every time you play open play drilling, whatever it is, you

should go in with one objective.

I've done this a bunch and I, it's always when I have the most rapid improvement is I pick

a thing.

And I'm like, that's the only thing I care about this game.

I don't care if I win or lose because losing one while you're learning a new technique

is inevitable.

You're going to play worse.

But here's a great example.

I had a session last year where my only objective was to get my service deep as possible.

I wasn't saying I need to win this point.

I didn't even care what happened after the point.

I didn't even care if I lost the game.

I filmed it.

I went home.

I put it in PB Vision and I was like, did I achieve the goal that I was trying to achieve

which was get the serve deeper?

And I looked at it and it was like 90% of my serves were worth in three feet of the

backline.

I was like, that's all I wanted.

I actually, if I recall correctly, I lost most of those games.

But people did tell me to end that session though, dude, your serve got a lot better.

All I did was hit it deeper.

Yeah.

That's, I don't even know that I was hitting it a lot harder.

So dig when you go in with the mindset of, here's the thing I'm going to work on today.

Am I doing it?

Yes or no?

Like if you've even walked into sessions before where my other objective is, I am only going

to cover the line, whatever side I'm on.

Like if the ball is right in front of me and I know it could go down the line because

I get made fun of all the time by my friends.

Never covers the line.

So I was like, I'm only going to cover the line.

And so if it went past my left shoulder and it was kind of unreasonable for me to get,

I'm like, my partner's ball.

Like I, this is what I wanted to cover and what I should cover.

So that's my only.

Dude, that is, that is a crazy topic.

The movie will have to write down for another pod sometime or just like a coaching segment.

Man, I've had some people where I'm coaching and I tell them like, they're like, okay,

but if I speed up here and it goes down the line, what if, what if he's like a recent

example, he's like, I speed up down the line and I feel like a lot of the times the ball

goes through the middle and I can't cover both.

I'm like, your job is not to cover both.

Yeah.

You know, you have to cover the line and your partner needs to get there.

That's a longer conversation we can maybe get into another time, but that happens all

the time.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, same that that has always been a big thing for me.

I try to cover too much, which means I'm really covering nothing.

Yeah.

So I need to just concede that sometimes it's got to be your partner that is doing the

other thing.

But man, we don't, we turn that question into a whole segment.

That was like 15 minutes worth of conversation.

We had a lot to say that.

That was a good, a good question.

So let's just summarize.

Let's summarize this simply.

Be a good person.

Don't be a jerk.

Be pleasant to be around.

But I get it, you know, like this is your opportunity.

People get amped up and really want to try and prove themselves.

Because like this is what I've been waiting for.

I really want to get in this.

But you got to just like let go of the ego and let go of the emotions and just be a friendly

person.

Because like you said, I swear that will take you so much further.

I mean, that's just a good life rule, bro.

That I mean true.

That's true.

And it applies to pick them all, but that's just a good life rule.

All right.

You know what?

What word are we going to do this week?

I didn't really, you know, I got to get better about this.

Dude, I always forget.

We're going to go with let's just go with three five this week.

You know what?

We'll put it.

Put it this three five.

Sure.

We'll go with a three five joke this week.

Actually, you know what?

Give us your best three five joke.

Yeah, that's all we do.

Give us your best three five joke.

I like it.

I'll say who's clever in the comments.

Wait.

All right.

Thanks for listening guys and we'll catch you next week.

Peace.