LeBron Injury Update and Giannis Fit! Big Questions With Steve Nash!

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Coming up on the Zacklow Show live from Spotify's offices in New York.

We got Steve Nash.

Yeah, that's Steve Nash.

He's joining us to talk about a whole lot of stuff that's happened in the Eastern Conference

in the last week, Jalen Durin's deal.

Cat, not getting an extension and talking about it.

Yardis is debut with the heat.

And LeBron James has the right to send his foot what's going on.

And then I put Steve Nash through the paces.

Some of the big questions of the NBA season.

Who does he think is going to come out of the East?

Who does he think has a puncture's chance in the West other than Spurs Thunder?

What team in the bottom of the West might have a chance to move up?

Who's his MVP pick?

What are his final picks?

Amazon Prime Steve Nash in the House.

And then Sean Fennancy in person in New York City,

home of the New York Metropolitan baseball club.

It's Met's corner.

We talk about playoffs.

We talk about diarrhea.

Yeah, that comes up.

We talk about the present and future of the New York Met's Carson Benj.

Did my struggles try to buy a Carson Benj jersey and a green Francisco Alvarez?

A lot of baseball talk to playoffs have been fun.

Sorry, San Diego Pajoris fans.

You've had a couple of gut punches.

All of that coming up on the Zach Lo Show.

Welcome to the Zach Lo Show and look who it is.

My sometimes Amazon Prime teammate, former head coach of the Brooklyn.

That's two time NBA MVP, Canadian all around sports legend Steve Nash.

How are you?

Very well.

All around sports legend.

I love that.

Sounds great.

Well, people say you're so good at tennis that it's borderline obnoxious,

given how recently you picked it up.

These are just sources that have spoken to me.

Team name sources.

Unnamed sources.

One of them is German.

By the way, two time MVP's.

Where are your MVP trophies?

Where do you keep them?

Can we say in my parents closet somewhere in a like a storage space?

And then I actually have loaned one indefinitely to the sun.

So it'll be in their front at the front office at the sun's headquarters.

Suns in Mercury headquarters here in Phoenix.

So you don't get to see them on a regular basis and admire them and think about all you've accomplished.

I that's not really my my MMO.

I kind of like to live forward.

But it's, you know, it's nice to you brought it up.

Maybe feel good for a moment.

Well, you know why I'm going to break some news right here, Steve.

This is very important to me.

I can now I think consider myself your peer because I have been named by the MVP by the

NBA as an MVP of I don't have the trophy in front of me, but they present in be a trophy.

I go to a meeting every year with their art and court design and Jersey people because

I love that stuff so much and they show me everything that's coming for the year.

They presented me like a gigantic trophy with like a guy taking a jump shot.

It weighs like 20 pounds and it's most valuable writer of art and design culture.

So I think I think, yes.

You know, I think the Hall of Fame is next to me, but I'm not home right now.

I'm at our Spotify studio.

I will put it.

I will display it.

My MVP trophy on the next podcast I do from home.

All right.

I prepped you with a lot of questions because you're going to be in America's living room

all the time and the world's living room on Amazon Prime NBA nightcap all that.

And it's time to get you on record for some big picture NBA stuff.

Are you ready?

I'm ready.

Okay.

First of all, we're going to the first big question is going to be about the Eastern

Conference.

A question that I've asked a million people, but since I started asking people this question,

four major things have happened in the Eastern Conference that I want your quick take on.

Number one, according to Dave McMahon, LeBron James, you know him as your podcast partner

on mind the game is dealing with chronic arthritis in his left foot.

I do enjoy how every LeBron injury is reminding me at age 49 of the injuries that are

befalling my peer group in suburban, loserdom, Connecticut.

Did you know about this?

Like how much of LeBron's life do you know about that you just keep secret and don't tell

anybody?

No, I did not know about this.

That was interesting.

You know, you sent me over the link.

This may have been something he's been dealing with for a few years.

You know, arthritis can obviously is a long term thing.

So this may be sound, you know, highlight worthy for you and I right now.

I did not know, but this might be something he's already been dealing with.

Like the sciatica, it's said in the same article.

So he clearly had his age, the amount of miles he's put on his body.

This will be the challenge for Nick Nurse is how do we get through a regular season, reach

our stride in the best health possible while also jelling, finding a way to play at both

ends and what our off speed pitches are, et cetera, et cetera.

When, you know, Joe has an injury history in LeBron has one billion miles on his body.

So I think that's the major, major challenge for Nick and for that team is how do they find

chemistry, how do they gel, how do they find a style of play?

Because, you know, often, and LeBron and I talked about this on the podcast, you know,

often you go into a situation and think, this is the way I think it'll be best for us

to play.

And by Christmas, you go, we can't possibly play this way.

And you change, you throw it all out.

Well, that timeline is pretty short when it's the first time together and the spring

gets here before you know it.

You've never been in those moments before collectively.

So it puts a lot of pressure on the pipe, so to speak.

And I think that that'll be his biggest challenge and their team's biggest challenges.

Managing the injuries and the history, the miles on LeBron and Joe while also finding

a style of play because I'm going to need them all to compete in the East.

We will circle back to the Sixers East item number two.

Yannis said to Kumpo made his debut for the Miami Heat in a preseason game.

I was the first preseason game in a while.

I've had circled on my proverbial calendar.

I was at Toronto or was no, was in Montreal, rather against a record.

I wasn't quite back to the, you know what?

Just I'm not even going to be welcome to in Canada.

I'm not trying to because such a cultural.

I'm a cast.

I want to make sure we got the beats right.

You know what?

I'm glad you called me out on it.

I've actually never been to Quebec City.

I've been to Montreal a few times, but not Quebec City.

I've heard it's gorgeous.

Sorry to the everyone in Quebec City.

I was eagerly anticipating this game.

The heat started the Clay Thompson version of their starting five, which is the one I anticipated.

They played that starting five two stints of about six minutes each and then went with

the whole bench mob.

Obviously they'll stagger.

I think Yannis and BAM a lot in the regular season.

But I wanted to see how that tandem looked, who had the ball the most, how they could

space the floor, how they could work together, how much of the heat's offense from last year

when they ran that like no pick and roll, all dribble drive, no, the Roche offense would

carry over into this iteration.

I know you caught glimpses of that game.

It's only preseason.

Did you see anything interesting?

That Yannis is a very tough cover still apparently.

He looked great.

One man wrecking ball, the athleticism, length strength, ability, skills, looks in mid-season

form on the clips that I saw.

Spool will do a great job.

Staggering, keeping one of them on the floor at all times and finding a way of play, a style

of play that they can play in crunch time most importantly.

So that I think is the difficulty of having a player who is so dominant with the ball

is, you know, it draws so much attention as Yannis is how do you play when he's off the

floor and finding as much of that chemistry and a new style of play theoretically when

he's off the floor because you can't just lean on him to create advantages every time

down.

And then of course, you know, BAM as terrific as he is is not Yannis offensive.

He's going to have to shoot more threes.

That'll be something to me to determine.

He's showed he's capable, but can he consistently get in that position where they leave him,

but they don't leave him and create some more space for Yannis or vice versa.

And then like you said, surrounding and reshooting seeing how some of those bench players come through

with this kind of new look heat.

So number one, what a great tool for, to spoke, for sport to play with.

Yannis drawing doubles and triple teams and opening it up for the rest of the team.

I think they'll be good defensively, but I still think although Quebec City look great,

there will be challenges offensively for them to see where their depth and rotations

come from.

Yeah, they lit up the raptors on offense.

I agree with you.

I don't need to read too much into those results.

I was struck by a couple of things.

Number one, just how central, this is going to sound stupid, but Yannis had the ball a

lot and was the fulcrum of everything they did.

It was not like an equal split with him and BAM running D.A. Joe's and stuff.

Like this is going to be Yannis's offense and BAM is going to have to kind of find a

way to coexist with him.

Liches, that you mentioned, they ran some two-man game together, which I think will be something

they try to go to.

Just put your best players in an action.

Teams are going to try to switch it.

But you know, some centers, some centers, slower centers have a hard time staying with Yannis.

And the raptors wanted Yaka Pertle on BAM and not Yannis.

And a lot of teams will match that.

Wiggins, they apparently went to Wiggins and just like, I want you to shoot 15-3s a game

because that dude was just like letting it fly with hands in his face the whole game.

And they clearly are going to carry over some of what they did last year offensively.

They ran some of that same Noel LaRose, dribble drive stuff.

It wasn't all pick and roll.

Yannis was a screener a lot.

So interesting TBD didn't really change by view of the heat.

I think they're good, but we'll see how great they can be.

Okay, the next two big of the big four things that happened in the east are both contract

related.

I'm going to start today, Carl Anthony Towns, basically came out and told the media,

I'll read the quote, simply put, I want to do something to keep the team together and

can work with the nicks and also values me.

None of these things are close to happening.

AKA, he basically said, we're not close to an extension.

Doesn't sound optimistic about getting an extension.

I think they're pretty far apart from what I've heard.

Obviously they met, they let Mitchell Robinson go already after James Dolan followed up

an NBA championship by immediately being like, yeah, we can't keep the team together.

Second apron kid do it.

I just, you were a player who cared a lot about the feel of your locker room and everybody

being engaged and everybody feeling happy and everybody touching the ball.

If this kind of thing with Kat and I think less so with Josh Hart lingers into the season,

personally, I think like Kat's a pro.

He was in trade rumors last year about Yannis, obviously it didn't affect their team.

I don't think there's going to be any like there's no overt, malcontent here or anything

like that.

I'm going to get back to Dolan in a second.

But can this stuff like affect the way the team plays on the floor?

Is this anything that would worry you as a nicks fan?

I mean, it definitely can affect things.

However, they fought through things like this before.

You know, you'll remember the quotes Kat had early in the mic, where he wasn't sure what

his place was on offense.

It sounded ominous.

Then they go out.

They win the mid season tournament and then they find a kind of a style of play.

A more, you know, egalitarian style, a style that I think made them more difficult to guard,

less predictable.

Put Kat in different position, used him as a hub.

Got the ball moving a little more, made it more difficult to load up on Jalen.

So they've worked through some things before.

Now money is money and I never want someone to have to turn down money if that is their

prerogative.

However, I think there's a common ground here where these guys are all going to make

so much money in their career that they can find that middle ground by not getting so

deep into second apron, peril.

And at the same time, he'd be rewarded for his role and a championship team and the team

going forward.

So I have hopes that they will figure out a balance that both can live with.

But that's the reality of the way these, you know, the salary cap is built.

It's very hard to be happy.

You know, you, you are going to be up against the apron if you build a good team.

And we're seeing that around the league and you have a decision like Boston or maybe

OK, see made this year to go in a direction that kind of gives them relief from the second

apron in flexibility going forward.

Or you have the next who are hot off a championship and that would be a bold move.

I mean, to change it all up right now.

The bigger question I think you're going to get to is what happened to the spending New

York Knicks of earlier iterations, you know, especially in this dull and era.

So that, that to me is more curious.

But I guess if that is, and who knows is that, is that a bargaining ship to say that or

is that, you know, are you laying down some sort of precursor to all these negotiations?

Or is that something that will come off of?

I'm not sure.

I'm glad you brought that up because I have a few takes I would like to get off on this

subject.

Just let's set the lay of the land first.

Cat has a $61 million player option for next season.

His max, if he opts out of that and signs a max and free agency is almost $70 million

a year average annual value.

I have said before that I think something like 50 to 55 a year per year, not starting

and raising for that per year seems like the kind of compromise that should be able to

get things done given cats age, his occasional limitations on defense and all that stuff

and what he's accomplished in his career.

I don't think anyone's close to that.

And I still think that is like a happy outcome for all sides that we'll get done.

It can keep the Knicks under the second apron or close to it for the next couple of seasons.

Okay.

Thing number two, I think I can already tell by the Twitter reactions that fans, and maybe

this is your point about Dolan, that there's a segment of Knicks fans who are mad at cat

for not sacrificing for the team the way Brunson famously did two years ago when he took

an extension.

I think there's a misunderstanding about that Brunson extension.

He signed the absolute max that he could sign at that time in the summer of 2024.

He did not take less in terms of what he could have signed at that moment.

He took less than he could have gotten if he had waited a year, become a free agent and

signed a five year max deal, which he chose not to do.

He chose to lock up the money, help the team's financial flexibility.

And I think he'll probably get the 35% max the next time his deal has come.

But I don't think it's fair to throw at cat.

Hey, Brunson Brunson took less.

You should take less.

He did not really take less in the sort of literal sense.

Number three, I've had a bunch of people tell me this in the last two or three weeks.

And I kind of tossed it away as like, maybe I'm half brainwashed by the second apron.

Maybe ever I just know that there are agents talking to me and nobody really likes James

Dolan.

I just I like this is the team that should spend over the second apron.

You just won the championship.

You have a championship team.

You don't just print money.

You like live on top of a pile of money from the Rangers, from the Garden, from the Knicks,

from tax breaks.

This is this is the whole reason you should be doing this is to have this kind of team.

And I and I've had a lot of people say to me like, you should be hitting James Dolan

harder for not spending more to keep this team together.

I'm like, a second apron respect.

I think those people are right.

And I don't I'm not saying catch just get the max.

But I'm saying this is like a you have the city's goodwill for the first time in a long

time.

And the team that is objectively a championship team, you've already let it slough away one valuable

piece that went to your rival Boston.

I just you know like this is the whole point of having a team.

I don't I don't I think James Dolan's getting off little easy and I don't like the anger

at cat that's burbling up.

I'll say that big thing in the East number four that's going to lead us to our first big

question.

Jalen Durin agreed finally after much drama to a five year, $200 million contract extension

with the pistons and all options, no outs, no nothing.

And it has led to I think a broader question that I wanted your expertise on of okay.

So now the pistons have a Sar Thompson locked up and Jalen Durin locked up and both of them

are non shooters, right?

And they have an all time lead guard and Kate Cunningham who needs spacing to maximize

what he can do.

And we saw in the playoffs that that combination, the floor is kind of tight.

I just you know, there's this sort of blanket idea that while you just can't win a championship

with two non shooters on the floor.

A couple of things.

Number one, Cade plus Durin plus a star take up only only only 70% of the salary cap.

This is not a case where like Boston had two guys taking up, you know, 80% of the salary

cap almost.

It's not a case of Oklahoma City who's going to have three guys taking up 110% of the

salary cap.

It's three guys 70%.

Yes, they missed out on Austin Reads with their like last bite.

It's a cap space apple this summer, but they still have like flexibility flexibility.

But I'm interested like them, the pistons and then the rockets with Shengoon and Amit

Thompson, two non shooters.

Both I think having ambitions of competing at the absolute highest levels soon, if not

this season.

What do you think of the idea that two non shooters is like a borderline disqualifier

for a would be championship team now?

Well, I would say it is a disqualifier, to be honest.

But that is not just my Mike Dantonie had on and understanding spacing and the way the

games played, officiated and analytics have, you know, impacted our game.

That is also because we're talking about competing with not just the New York Knicks, but

OKC and San Antonio Spurs to beat teams in that quality.

I think that is puts it even under a tougher microscope to have two non shooters.

Now, if I'm the pistons, I'm thrilled that I was able to sign those two young very talented

players.

Yes, during underperforming the playoffs, but at 40 mil, I think was reported that is

a pretty good buy for a 21 22 year old center with his ability as regular season performances

and his, you know, relationship with K that he can continue to develop into a, you know,

an all star-ish center at four, you know, especially in the regular season.

As far as I'm sorry, you know, this is just the guy you need on the basketball court,

right?

Yes, it hurts to have two non shooters.

I think that to be creative.

I think they tried with some of the cutting.

I was a little surprised they didn't put him in more short action under the basket or

he's coming, for example, pick and roll, Cade's coming to his right, Durin's rolling hard.

As far as coming from head under the rim to the strong side block showing, there is gravity

is immense.

I think that passing away, he's too athletic.

He catches these foulries finishing there and it allows the roller then to have one tag

on the backside.

You may say, well, that clogs it up for Cade to get downhill.

I think in our league, that ability at Cade's size and skill level, it doesn't matter.

Someone standing flat footed down there at the pain.

You can still attack the rim.

He's got his mid range.

He's got his three and he's got his draw and kick game or hitting the roller.

So I'd like to see him mix it up in more ways than that.

You can put him in the strong corner.

That's, I'm walking us through all the permutations.

No, I want you to.

Yeah, you could put him in the strong corner.

They'll probably muck off in there.

He could still cut behind, which I think is in play about more tricky.

I think for them, it's about variety and it's about development.

So I think Durin needs to develop a little bit more of some mid range shootings.

Some, you know, can he be more dominant in the middle of the pain on post ups on switches

when they try to switch defenses on Cade?

Can they, can their cutting packages be better for a SAR?

Can they turn people over to make up for the spacing issues to get out of transition?

You know, you should be able to with defenders like the three we're talking about in their

big three.

How can they stack the deck, play the possession game, give them an opportunity to overcome

some of the half court issues that they're going to have to play around?

But at the end of the day, you have to sign to your own players like that.

And any, at any point, you can make a move if you feel like that's not the case.

Similar in Houston, I think, you know, for me, the benefit and maybe a SAR goes in this

category, couriers his brother, how much can maybe the roller and the poor, the point guard

playmaker in those situations?

So can a SAR grow into it?

We've seen a man grow into it being able to ballhandle, make plays, getting attacking

the pain, where his gravity obviously is immense.

Can he be the screener and look at they both be the screener and roller and different

packages?

And then Shengoon, like for me, he's got to be a better three point shooter.

He has the ability.

He's shown it.

Can he now develop into being a high 30s, 40% three point shooter so that he has the optionality

to be the roller, to be the shooter, to let a man be the roller.

You know, now you have a lot of things, whether you're having small shepherd or Fred

Van Vleib screening for a man and then getting downhill, those guys popping, Shengoon playing

on the bass line, whatever it may be, how can you find variety and different ways to make

up for what is a perceived lack of shooting and spacing for your primary guys?

And also, like, how can you be good at other stuff?

You have to be a very good defensive team.

Can you like the rockets being elite rebounding team?

Can you be an elite free throw differential team, like chip away at all of these edges?

So I went through to help myself answer this question.

I went through every team who's made the finals since LeBron went to Miami to see like,

actually, let's look back and see how realistic it is for teams with two non shooters to make

the finals.

You know, famously like Oklahoma City did not get here until they kind of offloaded

Josh Gidey as like we just can't have you on our team.

Toronto had to trade Jonas Fowl and Junus for Mark Gassol to open up more spacing.

Like you have these like famous Perk and Oklahoma City.

They kind of ran its course with the two bigs there.

Miami transitions to Bosch at center more than two big guys together.

So all that said here are the combinations I found that we can say these are like legit

non shooting duos that shared the floor a lot for teams that made the finals.

And I understand that some of them are not applicable to the current Thompson twins

respective situations.

2024 Mavs Derek Jones Jr.

And all of their centers lively Gafford were like Jones.

That was like their most used line ups had Derek Jones Jr.

Who call him an on shooter.

Not he's guarded like one playing with rim running centers.

I've been real quick there.

Yes.

Derek Jones Jr.

PJ Washington shot the ball like Larry Bird and Derek Noiskey

to make the finals and then it's sort of one of my so maybe there's an anomaly in there as well.

We will get we will get to this.

Butler and Bam twice for Miami.

Now this gets back to your point that a these are two of the you know,

butlers of top 10 player at that point.

Bam is a top 20 player and they can both handle the ball.

So they're not off to the side.

In like a saw is more sort of like trying to find a spot off to the side.

I think would need to handle the ball more.

I'm just disqualifying every Dremon green plus like the bomb.

I'm just it's out like he's the greatest playmaking power for it all time.

He's surrounded by the two best shooters of all time.

Or with apologies to the person on the other end of this podcast.

Two of the best shooters of all time.

Janis and PJ Tucker.

I'm not even counting that because Janis is an all world ball handling player and PJ Tucker

could make corner three's or at least stand in the corner.

So it's not quite equivalent.

And then you go back to like the bubble lakers started Anthony Davis

and either Javille McGee or Dwight Howard from almost all that playoff run

until they had to go Anthony Davis at center when they were really stressed out.

They started Marquip Morris and then Alex Caruso.

And then way back when the spurs wanted in 2014.

Duncan splitter was there starting front court to finals runs in a row.

But like the further they got the less splitter played the more your old buddy

Boris D. I played.

So it I think the lesson of this is is not like, oh, yeah.

Of course you can win a title with two non shooters.

I think you can.

But it's really, really hard.

And one of them has to be your best ball handler or among your best ball

handlers or you have to have like LeBron or Luca or Cade, hopefully on your

team to simplify everything and make it work.

It's actually it's doable, but it's hard.

But I'm like you like I'm rooting for the pistons to succeed because I like an

MBA where there's a lot of different ways to win.

And I think a sartonson could take more of a ball handling role as or you've

or dribble handoff role, like just something to put him on the ball and out off the

ball. Jalen Dern's 22 years old.

He's going to get better and better and better.

They should be a great defensive team.

They should be a great rebounding team.

I just I'll say this over and over again.

You don't get to go superstar shopping at the super star grocery store.

This is what the pistons had.

If they dump Jalen Dern yesterday or in two months, they're going to have to

get assets to then use to get another big man who's as good at Jalen Dern as

Jalen Dern, but maybe can shoot easier said than done.

But that was an interesting walk down walk down history because it's possible,

but it's it's sub optimal.

And you make a very point like I'm looking at history.

You're looking at the future like here are the teams you got to beat at the top of

the West.

Like you got to be perfect to beat those teams.

If it was flatter at the top, maybe you could find a way or an easier way,

a more seamless way to win those margins you talked about.

I think that's the key here is how can they find those margins?

You know, obviously Houston's done it on the offensive glass.

I'm Steve Aladdin Adams at all, you know, Detroit defense.

He's been great.

Can they like you said turn people over?

Can they get the when the foul discrepancy?

It's possession game stuff that suits your team.

That that stuff matters.

I would say the other component here and that's where OK,

see one because I think when OK, see one, they really didn't shoot the ball that

well, the entire run now guys and I don't know if the numbers are

front of you, but it didn't feel that way.

But they're still threat and people still guard them and people still have to

make tough decisions and their style of play.

But to me, they won because they turn people over because of Shays brilliance

because of the different thing.

Yeah, you know, Jalen Williams showing up for 40 and a finals game like

they won because of all the other things, not so much that they didn't shoot the ball.

Well, so there's that there's the winning the possession game.

There's other ways to stack the deck in your favor that can kind of

overcome some of your spacing issues or finding a style of play that really suits

and committing to it, which is really difficult.

So I'll use the Warriors for an example.

Yes, Drainman brilliant.

Yes, two of the best shooters of all time.

But having Looney out there playing on the weak side as another sub,

you have to be up to touch a non shooter because it's courier clay on the

weak side firing off.

So you can't just muck in the paint if Kavon is sending 20 feet from the basket

because if that ball gets skipped to him and there's clay coming out of the corner,

you have to be up to the level.

So that's committing to a whole new way of playing that is very, very difficult.

I think from a coaching perspective, from a playing perspective,

and really buying into that.

So and when you have a player like Kade, it's even more difficult to someone who's

so dominant, so good with the ball to commit to the ball going to the other side.

And all men's catching it and going straight, you know,

DHO out of the corner with Isaiah Joe.

Brilliant, great.

But you know, now we've got to start from training camp saying that let's get the ball out of

Kade's hands, which is a completely different kind of cycle for a team and its evolution.

So I think that commitment, the Warriors made year after year made it possible

for them to play that way along with the obvious gifts.

But you would say nowadays Drainman Green and Kavon Looney on the court together doesn't work.

But obviously the way they played it did work.

By the way, before we move on to the big questions, one of the things that I'm just,

I'm just watching in my, it's in my back pocket night tonight when the season starts.

And I've used to do your take on it.

It was, it was notable to me as we talk about spacing and optimal lineups

that the tougher the opposition got, the more the thunder just completely went away from playing

shed home grand as the only big man on the floor.

I went from thinking this is what they're closing five is going to be.

Is like Shay Mitchell.

The top lineup.

Caruso and then Chatt is the only big.

And they basically just never did that when they go and got in touch.

Is that, what do you make of that?

Is that still, I assume that's still a look they want to get to.

But it was interesting to me that they backslid away from it.

So I don't think that that has to be thrown out.

I think they have gone away from it for sure.

I don't need to be thrown out.

That's something though that Chatt has to develop into it.

I mean, if he comes, becomes more of an ask kicker, both ends on the floor.

We know his impact offensively.

We know his talent offensively.

If he can become that guy that is shooting in a slightly higher clip offensively

is driving that gravity he's created by shooting better and is using his length to get in the

paint, make plays fouls, draw a crowd and make plays for others.

I think they can go to that lineup more.

I think as he's been a little up and down offensively,

they've probably sent back to our margins conversation.

Hey, let's be bigger.

Let's beat people up.

We've got Shetkin Space, Shetkin Rebound, offense rebound.

He can make some plays, but we have Heartstein to be that short roller to connect the dots.

And now we've got two seven footers who can give us, you know,

a real opportunity to control the glass at both ends.

And if we control the glass at both ends and we turn people over, we have Shay,

who can close games and take us home.

So that would be why I believe they've probably gone away from giving him the keys to that death line up.

Having said that, I still think Shet's going to continue to get better and develop.

Took this playoff.

Let's call it a failure.

I think that's fair.

I think we can call it a failure.

Yeah, I mean, you know, he didn't play it his best.

Then I think that that will spur him on, no pun intended,

to raise his game to become a more reliable shooter,

a more reliable closeout player, a more reliable kind of player that plays up to his capabilities.

Isn't I'm happy to be the third or fourth fiddle because he's his talent as a man's

his workout thing is there.

I think he's got the toughness and the will.

So I think his development is still all out there and that could give them an opportunity

to play that line up on different occasions if he continues to get better.

All right, let's take a quick break and then we'll do rapid fire.

Big questions with Steve Nash.

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All right, big questions with Steve Nash.

These are questions I've already asked myself and others, but my mind keeps changing.

I keep thinking about them all the time.

Question number one, if you have to pick a team to make the finals from the east,

and I, because it's my show and my rules,

I'm barring you from making the safe prediction and picking the nicks,

whether you want to or not, who would you pick to make the finals out of the Eastern Conference?

My, my, my, uh, uh, what's the word?

I said, my my nostalgia, my, uh, sentimentality says the Pacers.

I would love to see the Pacers.

However, having said that, they, they, they're capable of,

but they did catch lightning in a bottle in a lot of ways.

You know, what are the factors that they need to overcome?

First, Halley needs to be flying by the playoffs, which I think is totally a play for him.

They have to figure out Zeus' relationship with the team,

which I think is totally a play for him.

I think he's an excellent player.

I will help them.

I'm not worried about his, his spacing issues.

Allah, although he does a lot of other things.

Allah, the cave on Looney, weak side screener,

DHL hub, like this, this, I think his gravity will be fine.

Um,

TJ McCullough needs to get back to his best.

And then, you know,

getting some of these other guys to kind of find their roles.

And as they did, that, that bench mob was fantastic.

How they were able to speed the game up,

force turnover, is getting transition.

Who will that be for them going forward?

But in my heart, I would love to see the Indiana Pacers get back to that place because it's,

I mean, there's no more, nothing more tragic than an underdog story.

Well, I think honestly, I think one of the greatest stories in professional sports,

like, but we don't really talk about it anymore because they lost.

They lost in game seven where their best player,

but it tore as the killings and made, I think three out of four three is to start the game

and some from another area code.

So a very, very, very tragic end for them and to see them have the opportunity to get back there.

I'd like to, I would like to say that maybe that's sentimental, but that's my goal.

Okay, that's, I was going to say, it sounds like you have a heart and a head pick,

but you just have a heart pick and that, that's it. It's the Pacers.

Yeah, hopefully my, my head is, is, uh, is in there as well.

But yeah, they've got some, some things to prove, I think.

I can't, so I don't know if you listen to the episode I did with Goldsbury where I did this.

I have trust issues with all these other teams.

Just I've met massive things that I don't trust about them.

And in the end, I couldn't believe I did it.

I said, you know what?

If I don't trust anybody, I'm going to take the moonshot and I'm going to pick the Sixers

as my non-nix team.

And we all know the issues.

We talked about the word arthritis has already been said multiple times on this podcast

in regard to your podcast partner and the Sixers.

But that was, that was my pick.

Okay, big question number two, um, Western Conference.

Oh first of all, I think we just need to talk for 90 seconds.

You texted me out of the blue.

I hadn't seen you yet.

The Yokitsch backhand across the baseline pass in a preseason game.

I like the game was not even worthy of that pass.

Like I said, I said that for prime time on Amazon Friday night.

You know, 8.30 PM.

But I don't know that I've ever seen a pass quite like that.

And you are one of the greatest passers in the history of basketball.

When you see something like that, when you saw that, did it remind you of anything?

What was your reaction to it other than texting people like, dude, did you see what this

dude just did?

It's, I mean, it's, so I think a lot of players, especially a lot of great passers, they

see that getting it there is a completely other thing.

I mean, he was pushed out almost to the corner.

And now he's got to go on a rope to the other corner.

One like just doing that in an empty gym is not easy.

So I think a lot of great passers could see like, hmm, that guy's, he's, he's a little

high.

My, his defenders a little high.

I could get it there.

But by the time I turn and throw it, he's not high anymore.

He's stealing that pass.

So it can only be one way and that's disguising it and quickly throwing it behind the back,

where no one's eyes are expecting it.

And it disguises the ball from say his belly button to when the defender can actually

see it.

He probably won't see it until it's, you know, in the middle of the paint, which is too

late.

So seeing it is great.

I mean, great vision, great awareness.

Tricking the defender by going behind the back takes it to another level and then getting

it there on the money.

I mean, it's just ridiculous.

I don't know that there's anyone else in the history of the game that could make that

pass in disguise the way he did.

Just quick as he did and on a rope and on the hands as he did.

And that is just what makes Nicolaio so unique.

So unbelievable pass.

It's right on the money.

It's not even an inch this way or an inch that way.

It's right on the money.

And it's funny.

You mentioned the empty gym.

My first reaction was holy shit.

My second reaction was I wonder how long, how many tries it would take me with it, just

me and a shooter.

And no defender anywhere, totally empty gym, that exact location, that exact distance,

that pass one handed around the back.

I think I might need 500 tries and even that might not be enough.

I might just not be able to do it because it's so long.

Yeah.

And I think no offense that I could do it.

I could get it there in the first few tries, but my point is, I'm like a representative

no offense.

No offense.

It's at the two time MVP.

But my point is, is that for me to get it there, the inertia I would have had to create

the torque to get it there would have given the game away.

And the, you know, people would have read that and seen my body torquing and twisting

and turning.

Wait, but he's so big, strong that he just flung it with the arm and that disguised it

long enough that no one was the wiser and balls on the money and it's in the hole.

So that's what makes him special is his, if the height, strength, the vision, all combined

together, not to mention his ability to handle the ball put it on the floor, play bully ball

if he needs to shoot it, stretch it, get it in spaces that he shouldn't be able to get

into with his foot speed.

So the whole package is just what makes him special and that signed off for me.

Okay.

Big question number one related to this Western conference.

If we, if in this event we arrived in April at playoff time and there was a third team

in the West spurs are healthy, thunder's healthy.

There's a third team in the West that we arrive in April and say, Oh, wow, they actually

could like compete with these teams like more than a Hail Mary, more than a punches chance

to actually beat one of those two teams in a playoff series or at least it's like two

two going into game five.

What team would you pick?

Well, going through it in reverse order, I would say, and just to start a conversation,

I would say we're talking LA and then Houston and then somewhere between Denver and Minnesota,

depending on how these things unfold.

And so for me, I think if Aaron Gordon's healthy, I think Denver is my call.

But I also very intrigued.

I think Minnesota's floor could be lower than last year and they're ceiling higher.

So they're the wild card for me.

But if I had to pick, you know, on the spot, I would say Denver with a healthy Aaron

Gordon.

I pick Houston and I feel even better about my Houston pick the longer the preseason

goes.

First of all, the real pick is no one like if those two teams are healthy, I'm just

not sure there's anyone.

But I think people are sleeping on the rockets with Van Vliet back.

I think they're going to try to be more judicious with Stephen Adams and just just try to get

him through the 82.

Obviously, there's pressure on you.

Amy would doke on his staff after the offense looked for most of the last season.

Your whole offense can't just be rebounding your own misses.

You have to have a little more than that.

But I think Van Vliet is a sea change for them and I just think all the young guys will

get better.

I like that team.

Look, as long as Yokech is upright and if they're healthy, they're probably the best

answer.

I just don't.

It's hard for me to have faith that Aaron Gordon is going to be healthy.

I completely understand.

I just think Aaron Gordon is such an incredible player and such an incredible favorite in

the Coli Ocatch.

We just all want to see it.

We want to see these tough tights, conference semifinals with them flying.

But I think the Houston pick is a great one.

For the reason I touched on a little bit earlier is you have three young players there that

can develop a lot and they may take a leap when you talk about Alper and San Gune, talk

about a man Thompson, talk about Reed Shepard.

Yes, Fred Van Vliet will have a huge impact on their team, not even as much he will on

the floor.

But more so, I think just as a personality, as a leader, as a calming influence, he would

be incredible for that team.

But those three young guys still have a lot of upside.

If they all improve a little bit, let alone if one of them takes a bigger jump.

I think that's a team that could really, like you said, be slept on so far this season.

Yes, Tarieson and Jabari's in junior, you can show them into the progress.

And you are the very young player as well.

Sorry, I didn't mention it.

And also, I think Marcus Smart is legitimately helpful for them.

That kind of slid under the radar.

He was good for the Lakers last year.

I'm not sure what you can rely on for him shooting wise, but he was good.

And there's like, I assumed that Bogdan Bogdanovitch, who signed there for the minimum, was

just kind of at the end of his MBA career and I assumed he wouldn't do much.

I've heard he's actually playing pretty well in camp.

It's like the more, the more little triggers you can show in playoffs, the better.

So we'll see.

I agree.

Great.

Big question number three, also from the West, the sort of reverse of this.

And maybe the answer is no one, but I'm making you answer it anyway.

If you mentioned Lakers, Rockets, Wolves, Nuggets as the four teams underneath San Antonio,

Oklahoma City, sort of the top six, the non-play and real playoff.

Teams from last year.

I think the odds are they are the same six, non-play and real playoff teams this year.

But if we got to the end of the season, maybe one of them takes an injury, maybe the

little model thing doesn't work, whatever, what team below them could you see having a semi-plausible

path to unseeding them for the sixth seed or the fifth seed or whatever?

Or is there no team?

No, I think it's possible.

You know, I will go any further than my Phoenix Suns.

I think that they're the Lakphenics as a terrific coach.

They have a very stable leader in Devon Booker.

And they have a bunch of combative, competitive guys that want to play together and play

the right way.

I think for them, they're going to have to have some leaps from some of their young guys.

Come on Malwalk.

Also in the Darra.

You know, Rushier Fleming.

some of these guys are going to have to continue to improve and and I think that is their upside going

to this and make it but because they are such a competitive greedy group that is well coached and

coachable they could surprise some people and then you know you look at Portland's I don't know

what to make up for them you know they they prove they can really defend this year and then

then we imagine they're going to put out lineups to start the year that aren't defensive lineups

so it's very interesting to see how they can balance the two how they can find a way of playing

that spreads lineups and makes them potent offensively but also doesn't completely lose their

identity they formed last year with kind of size length speeding people up turning them over

because I thought that identity was great a little more shooting they would have a chance to

be a really tough out the West have you tried to help also a good are with its free throw shooting

are you allowed to do that if you try if you've done this I am allowed I haven't so far yet

there's a lot of great coaches over there I don't want to you know get in there but I'm definitely

happy and have my thoughts but he this these guys I will say about also he works his tail off

I mean everybody loves that kid yeah he works his tail off as do the rest of those guys I just

mentioned a few minutes ago and and that's why they were able to win games but no one had them

winning any last year speaking of the suns before we get back to to West stuff how was it seeing

Mike d'Antoni and Amari Stottemi are inducted into the Hall of Fame this year I assume you were

there I was not there I was in Europe but particularly d'Antoni who you know you just never

know when these coaches who don't win the championship are ever going to get their do it took

Rick Rick Adelman forever I thought he should have been in the Hall of Fame a long time before that

I was I've just been super happy for both of them but obviously they both change your career

and you change their careers what was that weekend like what are your favorite memories from it like

what's what's going to stick out to you yeah it was a blast I mean it was first of all the main

thing is just being incredibly proud and and excited to see them both be recognized for for

their greatness Mike has changed the game in so many ways and you know whether it's what he did with

us you know at Phoenix or what he did with with the rockets I mean you know he's he's I saved to say

he didn't get it it didn't get a ton of bounces in some of those series but he had his team in the

hunt and I think changed the way people look at the game so just an incredible impact super bright

basketball mind but also just a world class human being and Amari Amari is one of the most

unique players we've ever seen the combination of incredible feet explosiveness size strength hands

you know very very rare combination how nimble he could be at his size what a pick and roll

partner he was for me to see him overcome so much in his life you know he went to so many high schools

you know whatever you overcome from his childhood through high school to the NBA to getting to where

he got with with let's not forget like my micro fracture the eye you know different things you

have to overcome physically as well as the things he overcame in his life I mean just a tremendous

you know result for him to be where he belongs and the hall of fame and so to be there to celebrate

them for them to go in together was really a special weekend for all of us Phoenix sons

have you really still have you still never read second seven seconds or less I haven't

uh I I didn't interview with you 10 10 my read it 10 years ago we sat down for an interview in

the Empire State Building got only knows what you were promoting I think it was soccer related

and I asked you and I was like flabbergasted that you had not read seven seconds or less by

Jack McCollum about an inside account of the 2005 six Phoenix sons and 10 years later you still

have it right it's time Steve it's time yeah maybe it is I mean I love Jack and obviously spend a

lot of time with him that season and beyond you know a guy a guy from my hometown wrote a book about

me you know kind of from high school through college I never wrote that either you know I think it's

more about me not feeling comfortable reading about myself than it is about the authors or the

material but maybe it's time to one of these days to pick it up and give it a read I don't think you

could write that book today because it is a very honest portrayal of your team and one of the

reasons it was on my mind is not only because you're coming on the show today but because of the

stuff I talked about before with cat and Josh Hart and sort of these like issues hovering over

you probably remember this better than anyone but in that book which is about the old 506

sons I would say Amari does not come off super well like there's a lot of questions about how hard

he's attacking his rehab he has a knee injury that year and there's like this push pull of

should be one of back is he attacking it hard enough and Marion who's one of my all-time

fairer players from the outs of looking and I love Sean Marion he is like throughout the book

kind of jealous of you and Amari and like he'd count the jerseys that the dance team was wearing

is like well there's five Amari and five National like two Marion like that's not fair do you

remember again as someone who's like very much in touch with chemistry and the vibe of the team

do you remember those kinds of things and trying to just wrap wrap everyone and sort of a hug of like

look can we put all this aside and just play like do you remember Sean being that way do you

remember Amari those questions about Amari and just trying to bring it all together

yeah you know yes but at the same time none of us are perfect and I don't I don't want to

misattribute this quote but there is I think a long-time NBA assistant slash head coach that said

when someone was complaining about their team sitting there on the bench said hey never

underestimate how fucked up they are too you know the nobody's perfect no team is without its

its issues it's about overcoming it sometimes those issues and overcoming them can be what breaks

the team from mediocre to good or good to great so yeah we weren't perfect all of us had our flaws

as do every team in the league and those guys were incredible teammates to play with and you know

that's just a part of playing in the NBA it is not just a game anymore in his business its family

legacies it's all sorts of other things that you have to manage and try to put in the right

perspective and you know I think generally we did a really good job of managing all that stuff

and everyone kind of got over it and played and got down to business just like the next day

last year and I think they will this year a couple of highlights from that book that I wanted to share

with you first of all Amari is coming back from injury and as he's coming back one of the

ways they test them out was they haven't played one-on-one against Boris DL in practice and Eddie

House who's your teammate that year observes this game and his summation of it I don't know if

anyone has told you about this about this quote his summation of it Boris kicked his ass and his

summation was Boris brought the French pastry on his ass which I always thought was a great

a great line and and if you had to guess what is the number one basketball complaint the coaches

lodge about Steve Nash in that book what do you think it is basketball that personality thankfully

your personality is it gets off scot free but a basketball complaint either my defensive

liabilities right on shoot enough it's the first one but it's a specific defensive it's a specific

I wouldn't even call it a liability I would call it a decision making process defensive decision

making process this could be a long this could be a podcast but I I mean I can go in I can go

in different directions you know it could be don't get hurt no it could be the tricky thing for me

was I had a lot of coaches throughout my career don't get in valve trouble dope so I wasn't aggressive

enough defensively now you have to tell me your hospital gear stop helping all over the court

and just stay home you helped too much okay that's good to I can see that I it's been a while but I

can see it valid yeah a big question number four if who is your preseason MVP pick and yes I will

make my own pick I'm not going to be unfair like that but I'm making you make a pick um

give him he plays enough games I'm gonna say Robbie me too he is me is my official Zach Lo Show

preseason MVP pick it's a it's a it's obviously a games played question fair or not I think voter

fatigue slash foul grifting narrative will will work against Shay Lucas seems to never play enough

games but obviously it's all set up for him Yoke it's just still there Yannis games played issue

he's getting a little dirt I think Wembee is the safe bet by the way speaking of the pushoff

issue you and I got to see my name a cut you and give us his presentation about the they're

going to now legislate this or try to legislate it out of the game what did you think of of that

in this general move the four Fs remember the four Fs yeah yeah yeah yeah four firm firming up

force feeling yeah and forceful essentially they're trying to you know define kind of the gray

area uh in my mind is it great you know great I still think we're going to get some of these wrong

like it's not black and white it's you know how much force how in front is the defender you know

how much like you said feel and firming and all these things hopefully the fans get an understanding

of that you and I are probably still developing um but it that that is a play that I think yeah I mean

we can clean that up we can define it we can make that gray area get down to 55 45 maybe where

there's that little 10% where we're going to get them and you you think it's one I think it's the

other but I think it's good to move in that direction you know I didn't I didn't want to sidetrack

the montage presentation but I had more kind of thoughts and questions on how physical we can

be outside this repoint area on ball handlers but then not inside versus and I brought it up but

I didn't want to follow up as how we can really running back full back a guy into the stanchion now

and it feels like unless that guy goes down there's no more dislodge um so we now are looking at the

chicken the the arm extended the chicken wing but if you put your shoulder into a guy it feels like

unless that guy reads it and flops and goes down for a charge like you can just put a guy in the

stanchion and so there's a few areas that like I'm not out of problem with them I just want them to

be called what they are right now it's like we've gone into this new era of of what's acceptable

just like the step through we used to allow that in women's basketball now the son we allow that

step through extra step in men's but we never said hey we're allowing that now we just started so

I always kind of wondering like what well how did we get here and if you explain how we got here and

why I think you know it would make more sense contextually as to where we're going with the game but

sometimes it feels like we evolve into these places of calling the game that I don't know how we got

here and why that's now legal I have no problem with some of these things being legal but I'm not

sure how and why we got here and they are all of a sudden legal so sometimes I'd love that clarity

but it's just it's so much there's so much to the game with the coaches the players trying to

always find an advantage and the referees are you are often one step behind trying to catch up to

what players are trying to do it to whether you call it rifting or adapting you know the game

with all his players evolve coaches evolve and they're going to always try to get an advantage

I think it's going to be a little bit of a mess because frankly I didn't see the difference

between some of the plays that Monty deemed legal and others that he deemed illegal and there's

going to be a lot of flopping as a result there obviously going to try to penalize flopping but

you know we'll see by the way just I can't remember what W game I was watching recently

the rule that I'm actually ready for and I realize it's a fairly radical solution that could

read you lead you down some radical places I'm ready for like an ultra harsh penalty on fouling

up three I just think it ruins the end of some of these games I hate it if you take it to its logical

extreme it becomes the e-limending and let's just let's just light the fouling out of the game

completely at the end of games I think I hate the fouling up three and I can't remember which

game I was watching that it kind of marred the finish of but I get the strategy behind it I would

want my coach to do it in a lot of cases if I were just like win it all costs I think it sucks I'm

ready for like you get like five free throws of somewhat value up three I'm fine with that I'm fine

with taking that out because I would say right now as a coach I would imagine almost every single

coach of the league is going to foul up three so if you want to change it I think you got to change

it and that kind of proves the point if everyone really is going to foul up three more or less then maybe

we probably need to look at the rule and and analyze it yeah I I'm resting is hard you know like it is

it is difficult but some of these rules change like for example how about this we talked in that

meeting about shortening the length of games so how about one free throw to make two I disagree with

that hate that that's silly and changes everything it's Mickey Mouse to me however what about you know

and Monty would say well you have 10 seconds to shoot no you don't you know we we and I love Monty's

great but we you know the honest has gone over 10 seconds you know so Tucker what about when the

rough hands of player the ball however there's rough hands of player the ball you have 20 seconds to

shoot two if anyone gets in the way if anyone gets in the way of it it's to lay again what about my high

five I got a high five people between the free throws go ahead but you have 20 seconds to shoot the

ball you have 20 seconds to make to shoot two free throw so you can fight ball you won wait a second

you were the coach of the nets wasn't it to nets who did the count the honest countdown on the scoreboard

and you guys got slapped on the wrist for it and told not to do it anymore we I believe we did

now that wasn't a part of that was a game of thing that not necessarily no I like the idea that

you went you and Sean Mars got together in like a nefarious layer somewhere in a in a boardroom

and we're like how can we mess with the honest I couldn't believe that the league told you not to do

it because my reaction was how about the referee telling the shoot the goddamn free throw within 10

seconds it that was a weird one you know it was it was a rule we are based I guess you know the

nets and fairness were just augmenting the rule forcing the rule and it was outside so

anyways I just think if you want to sleep speed the game up we don't need you know a minute to

take free throws here you get 20 give them a ball you got 20 seconds and if you want to high five you

can if not you know but like you can use that 20 seconds how you want it will speed the game up

I think and that's my crazy idea the day so when I watch games I often watch them on from behind

or on replay so I'm fast forwarding through free throws when a normal when most players get fouled

30 seconds is what I will fast forward three 10 second hits gets me to the second free throw going in

with the honest I hit them one minute forward button immediately and sometimes it's a little too long

and sometimes it's like he still hasn't shot the second free throw and I'm like what's happening here

all right do you want to make a final prediction or not I haven't made mine officially yet I'm not

going to today but you're here I don't know if you've already made one if Amazon's made you make one

I saw you guys have a little you and you D and Dirk and Blake had a little meeting I know if you

all of you were there were they wanted you to make predictions and Blake flat out refuse to make

any I don't know if you're ready to unveil to the world I don't know that I'm ready you know obviously

I'm thrilled that we have these two incredible teams in the West I mean this hopefully is go even

obviously I hope there's a third and fourth team and hopefully it's this year because you name

team Yoke Kitchen whoever you know really push those two teams but I mean I think it's fascinating

that we have these two young incredible teams with great balance you know physical defensive teams

I can also score the ball like this is fantastic so I haven't really put myself in a position to

make that claim with any education yet and I think it's also going to see how the season starts to

play out what does Czech do this year how how does you know the changes that OKC made to the rest

of their roster affect them you know just some of their guys take a leap as Jalen Williams healthy

and you go to the same thing with the squirters you know what leapsed is to their young cards

slash one be make well housed to bias Harris affect their team all those types of things so I'm

not going to make a prediction of thrilled we have those two teams I hope we have a seven game

series again and I hope some teams can push them on the way there and then in the east you know I

still still give it to the mix I think like you said as far as trust and reliability they've proven

that they won the in season tournament they won the NCS and see and they won the NBA finals

when there's something put in front of them they have a way to go and get it and so I trust them

but as you know especially in this modern era health is everything so whoever gets to the

finish line healthy is going to have the best chance to win I am I am also sticking nicks coming

out of the east I don't think the extension stuff is going to affect how they play on the court

and I don't trust anybody else my West pick remains TBD I lose sleep over every night I'm

lean I have a lean but I'm not ready to reveal the lean uh Steve Nash you're the best um look for

you on Amazon Prime all season long holding it down with the crew I'll see you out there some too

uh thanks for your time but thank you talk to you soon Zach

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look who it is oh in person met corner in New York City Sean Fennessy is here how are you I'm

good how are you I'm good man you're here for some some movie stuff now some meds are not playing

anymore no no historically when I come to New York for the New York Film Festival it's usually

very well timed to the postseason in 2024 we had magical times and I was able to experience

some of that magic in New York City this year not so much that's when I got back into it you

could have arrived early for David Stern's end of season press conference this is just one gem

after another we and I created a potential for an uncapped downside scenario I've already made

all the jokes um he is ruined I mean look he's probably a very nice man who has accomplished more

than I will ever accomplish and I kind of like I like to we're all like head over heels about

Jefferson Rojas and the prospects and Mitch Void get Marcus see me in the hell out of here like

the whole thing like he's very good at his job I do regret to say between his voice his business

school lingo I I have a lot of quarters I like them I don't think I can wear them anymore I almost

wore a light blue one today as a joke and I think he's ruined the quarters if for me I don't think

I can go back anymore he's in a really tough spot because he can't pivot the persona now like he

can't try to change and be more of like a rugged outdoorsy type at this point like he is an

analytically minded um NBA minded baseball general manager president of baseball operations like

that and that's an archetype that has been very successful and baseball over the last 20 years

he came he came in with a great track record of building small market teams and now he is

too many fans enemy number one it's a tough spot I think it's a little unfair I didn't enjoy

the firestones chant you have a hot take um you think pitalanzo has gone too far with the t-shirt

just like simmer down with the t-shirt that says 300 home runs you're still fiddling with your

formula you're like okay we've got good we're good you got your curtain call at city field even

that I thought was a little much we're good we had one year of angst over the Pete situation I

participated in that angst let's go to the next phase that's how I feel about it uh to the next

phase involved like someone playing first base for the match next year man what do we have a plan

for first base first of all uh polanco I want to shoot him into this into the stratosphere uh Jared

god bless him had a really nice season there's a place for him on the team next year not quite in

an everyday first base but but pretty damn good had that super scary fall yeah uh concussion at the

end of the season my daughter and I were watching together and that was the first time I've seen her

like look this is a little scary daddy like what happened it was really scary and it sounds like

he's doing better so shout out Jared young like enjoyed the hell out of the experience I'm happy

to have him on the team we do need another first base when it cannot be marked vietos and I don't

know who it's gonna be I would love for them to identify on the trade market in every day first

basement it's a little hard watching a handful of guys gosh you know ty france for the podres this

year had a really good year and he was on the market and you might have said that would have been

an interesting bylaw candidate he did you do hit the ceiling he is um when it's a kamarakami obviously

that was a tough one has had a really good season in Chicago not hitting for a lot of average but he

hit 35 home runs so like there's a couple things that seemed like stern Z moves and he made the

polanco move and then the polanco move led to Jared young becoming a more significant part of our

lives if we go into the year next year with Jared young and another platoon player it has to be

really uninspiring I think though for like a disastrous season I feel like I ended up feeling

like I'm ready for next season and baseball don't mess this up you're gonna ruin my family life

like just I need a hundred games a hundred games minimum just representative season but between

the guys tearing up the minor leagues between bench bench is a superstar benches is superstar in the

making 2020 like a highlight in the outfield every night a j uing writing the ship for the last

20 games hitting for some power and like amic and peachy and void like I don't know much about

much void but I'm excited about the stats jefferson rojas like did we look we're not going to get

p-core Armstrong but do we like reverse do we like do we can we make our version of it with

the clubs and even steal clay homes back this is all like I feel pretty good for a team that has

shit here well that's the thing is if if if you're one of those people who comes out and says I hate

David serons and I want him to be fired then you are removing the person who his primary skill and

the thing that he is focused on most organizationally is player development and and and youthful

acquisition and like that is where he built his reputation with other teams like the guardians like

the brewers so you know the the players that we developed this year no one the clean

Carson bench uing you can put Zach Thornton in the mix there if you want to sure you can put

Nate lavender in the mix yeah what's the status of my boy purple rain Nate lavender my guy I mean

hey he should be in the bullpen next year shouldn't he he'll be amazing I got a look at I got

look at his contract situation but out of nowhere like it was just an automatic out every time I

mean you can make the case that he should be the seventh inning guy no matter what going in the next

season so I think Sterns is doing the thing that I suggested to you might be happening on this

podcast last December which is we had a conversation when Edwin Diaz and Peter Lonzo left

them 24 hours of each other and I was like there this is a soft rebuild to bridge happening this is

a bridge a Jorge Polanco two-year deal swapping out a brand-in-a-mo from Marcus Semyon all of these

moves are like deck clearing long-term moves because you've got two massive contracts on the

books and otherwise what you want to do is be able to developmentally bring in young players

his mentality as a team builder is athletic young bats guys who are very positionally flexible

and you know whether I don't think he intended to have a 75 win season I think the hope was to win

87 games and get into the playoffs and things went disastrously wrong and we've talked about them

a lot over the last six months but I do think weirdly you could make the case that for 2028 they're

right on track the problem is we still have 2027 to play and I have serious doubts about whatever we

can be in 2027 I don't know how you feel about it well because we have pieces but we don't have

clarity in a couple of places and so Marcus Semyon still has two years on this deal Jorge Polanco

still has another year on his deal Koda Senga has another year on his deal Sean Manaya has another

year on his deal first of all Koda Senga I have to stop you for saying this has been bugging me for a long time

you don't get an entrance song Koda Senga as the as the closer because you can't do any other job

competently enough this is the one that's left to you so he chose beat it as his entrance song

yeah nope we're not going to do it what's your entrance song when you're closing for the mats I

mean enter Sam and is untouchable like I don't even feel like an answer to that question is

is I can't even no one will ever top that yeah I don't even want how about nothing how about just

nothing silence wow silence and they put like a tombstone on the jump on yeah we're not just the

undertaker bell you know the hell it's close to hell's bells which fucking don't even get me started

on Ryan Hellsley stealing hell's bells from Trevor Hoffman yeah but Koda no you don't get an

entrance song and he's like you know what else I'm sick of I'm sick of him and his who's

interpreter just constantly putting a little bread crumbs like I want to be a starter I want to be a

starter I'm not like he's not super psyched with the quick you know you know I would love you to be a

starter get some outs then you can be a starter again I don't I don't think he'll be a starter next

year well then stop talking about it and get your no entrance song and move on I know I

appreciate it that he went into the bullpen and you know he had some ups and downs but he was

pretty good right he was pretty good in the bullpen at the end of the season I just don't think

I think this leads to the tarqs schoolable conversation well yeah this is like the I believe in

Christian Scott who my daughter loves Christian Scott I don't know what what it is about him but

she's all in I believe in Thornton but I believe in them is like fourth and fifth starters who

eats to mennings and are like pretty solid yeah I think Scott could be a three if he continues to

develop and if we get to the end of the season and they have like a three nine year a and they've

done okay fine I don't know if I believe in more than that and obviously we all believe in McClean

we do not believe in Maniah at this point the six inning and on thing was like a disaster it was

so yeah that's they've got to rebuild the bullpen but most importantly they need to have a

guy or two in the starting rotation where I feel confident you know who would be great the Freddie

Peralta who's been pitching for the Tampa Bay race for the last month and a half yeah well okay I'm

the Twixing between on that right obviously it's upsetting to watch him completely turn it around he'll

be starting tonight for the go raise baby is a go raise Yankees we'll see how he does he is still

mostly been pitching five things you know what he because I'm cheering for Tampa Bay because I

would cheer for anyone against Yankee he's gonna shit the bed tonight I'm gonna call it right now

it's 1220 pm he's shit the bed for the meds he's gonna shit the bed tonight it's gonna be one one

it's Schletler to write not to he's facing off against you know and he's an animal that guy is just

he's a beast he's the best picture in baseball he's so good yeah and he just looks like he can hold

up for every big he's strong yeah I know it's hard to be not having that right now McLean's

an animal will be all right but the the Freddie thing even if that had worked out let's play it out

let's say he pitched to a three ERA this year and he was good but he was still doing the thing he

does five inning Freddie would you want to extend him for eight years and 250 million dollars no

no like I wouldn't want to do that so maybe it's a blessing in disguise would they get for him do we

get anyone good for him uh yes we did I think we got might have gotten two players was a million

P-tree I think he might be in that a million P-tree was the piece who came over they have this

weird thing now where the the meds have three to four second base prospects and they're gonna

have to figure out who is gonna go where between Rojas and P-tree and and Void who they drafted

themselves so yeah it's uh Freddie well we got Gary Gill Hill in that trade that's right people are

high people are high on him yes and he has a great name that you love to say GGH Gary Gill Hill

Gary Gill Hill on takes the hill but I mean do you want to you want to give Tark Scooble 800

million dollars that's the question well that's that's what they're and that is like Sterns was

nudged about that in that press conference that you said ambivalent ambivalent response

nose we need pitching nose we need a frontline pitching pitcher I think he would prefer plural

and maybe less good than Tark Scooble but like very good two or three guys um sure great anytime you

can get less good you got to get less good um let's go first of all how are we liking the baseball

playoff so far we're watching in the low household we've got it on the background I've I've extended

bedtime a couple of times and it's been a controversial decision yeah I mean I've been on the road

so I haven't been able to engage as much as I normally would but at the baseball playoffs rock now

I think they're too long and a lot of teams get in they probably shouldn't get in but

when you look at the last couple of Brewers Padres games oh my god I mean that's just it's been

electrifying my freshman year roommate in college is from San Diego shout out John um huge

Padres fan and we are old enough so that in our one room double in school I would be on my

computer and he would be on his computer refreshing net scape windows of he had the Padres game I

had the meds game of like but we didn't have access to like watch the games it was just a pitch-by-pitch

yeah and I'm just gutted like gutted when they made the world series in 1998 it was one of the

happy moments of his life then the umpires conspired to give Tino Martinez infinite amount of

strikes and the whole thing went to shit and the main like you can't lose two more painful games

than that for a team that's never won the world series are they're kind of Matt's West right I

mean that's right they've never won a world series they've been they've had some really really

really frustrating games go against them over the years game one of that series with the Thai

France ball off the roof is couldn't tell what was going to happen it like I'm gonna go and foul off

the bat if you froze it if you froze it like when it when it's just off the bat like the initial

you're looking at him like the batter cam I would have guessed it would have gone foul yeah but it had

a really weird trajectory it was just like went up and maybe not foul I don't know it's hard to know

what would have happened but not knowing is almost more painful so that sucked and then you know

Mason Miller is the best closer in the universe and went up against Jackson Churrio who's one of

the two or three most exciting young hitters in the game and yeah he lost speaking of great

closer walkouts he has the best right now to the corn song Mason Miller oh but that was that was

demystified a bit last night I mean he really he did blow that game we should also mention that

among all the met's people that traded away our left um Pete's gotten a lot of publicity

Paralto's gotten a lot of publicity back and forth Clay Holmes was okay it took very good for

Chicago depending on the night huge mistake for them to not start him and that's in the previous

stage Edwin Diaz has now had three or four straight scoreless appearances including one of the playoffs

but you know like I don't know if it's a feather in Cernes's cap but that three years 60 million

dollar contract would look pretty crappy it would it would but that that is so dodgers though for a

huge contract player to have a disastrous regular season and sit out half the season and then

come back in the playoffs and be wildly effective I mean that has happened for them with a handful of

these big you know like snow a Tyler Glass now like a bunch of these guys who get injured or have to

be shut down and then they come back in the playoffs and they look like the aces that they are it might

happen with Kyle Tucker too I saw you home run the other day by the way speaking of Mason Miller I

just looked up his play offsets because I'm not familiar with Mason Miller's career or work other

than I know he's awesome in the meds like sniffed around maybe trading for him it just goes back to

my I don't even I'm not educated enough to make this take but in my peak baseball fandom years

I thought this single most valuable player in the world was Mariano Rivera because he was just

an automatic win save in the playoffs until 2004 and all these other closers who would

also be awesome in the regular season like Trevor Hoffman gets in the world series blows the

save like forget Armando Benitez who would like you just like I couldn't trust that guy to save his

life Mason Miller I this is his second postseason postseason ever he I think he has four total

appearances like you got to win that game like the third season is now over they're not going to win

three games in a row yeah I mean they asked them to get to the the ass in the pitch two innings

I mean that's really the thing that's Mariano Rivera would do that all the time I know we're just

in a different era where that's more uncommon and in a high leverage spot like that he just couldn't

do it I've never been more scared of an athlete than Mariano Rivera because it infected your

experience of the entire game if you were if you were behind three to two in the third inning you

already started thinking about like we got to get the lead we got to tie this game because this

guy's like a looming I don't know if there's any closer in the sport right now that has that

reputation and I'm not sure it's mostly because closers are not managed in that same way and there's

sometimes that you know one of the best things I thought that um that buck showalter would do with

Edwin Diaz was he would frequently pitch him in the six or seven days but this is what got

maddenly all the bad pub and philadelphia when he brought Durin in or whatever his name is in the

seventh to face the best hitters on who were they playing the brave the brave's yeah uh that I

thought that all the analytics like when rob nyer was writing columns 25 years ago he still is was

like that's how you should use your I thought that was how the smart teams should use their close

the same concedus you should hit your best fitter best you should put your best hitter first

in the lineup because you want to have the most of bats every time I watch a team that I don't

know very well like I'm doing now in the playoffs and they lead off with a guy who has like 35

homeruns and I'm like man baseball has really changed a lot like it's it can't and I feel it more

because I was out for so long so this probably happened gradually but when we were kids that guy

hit cleanup like there was no third or fourth that was like where you hit yeah now it's a badge

amount or to hit first you're like a power hitter like all I wanted from my lead off guy was get on

base would be fast yeah you're it's so funny because you you listen to people who talk about the

bets and they're already citing what the what the 123 four will be next year and it's like very

clearly lindore soda of a shed and bench bench would have been the lead off hitter for this team

easily I mean maybe AJ you might have been long term but he would have easily been in 1997

and now he's considered their best option a cleanup hitter should we go through some players

and do you want them on the team next year yeah that's a good game simian no

uh I don't even care it doesn't matter let me just get it out right now okay I understand I

understand the brand and demotry it I would not have won branded nimo on the team for five more years

I I understand and I understand making room for outfielders because we had two really exciting

prospects and I understand getting off that contract long term intellectually but what I don't

understand is why Marcus simian had 600 of that's I why Ronnie Mauricio was not on the major league

oh we didn't talk about this how Keith Hernandez actually lost it in the last game of the season when

he was like we have mismanaged yes Mauricio whatever it was miss miss use that was like that was

I mean the meds broadcasters are the gold standard they like all broadcasters want to see the happy

picture but like that was a big big shot it for Keith to be Keith is friendly and they're like I

don't give a fuck mode of his career as he should be and it makes him a great broadcaster and he was

right what literally Marcus simian was one of the five or six worst position players in the sport

all year and in the first half of the year his defense wasn't very good so the whole idea for

plugging him in there I don't know that just seen in a lost season in a year where it was very

clear you were not even going to cross 80 wins to keep giving him at bats I don't I can't make

sense of it in our way out of options with Mauricio and we are they basically both have to make the

team next year yeah and to me baby is baby baby ready redeemed him so both to baby baby ready I'm

I mean I'm back in on baby as like a like a like a I don't my I just have to temper my expectations

he's a utility player he's a guy who plays three or four different positions on the field he doesn't

play every day but he's in a jam in a long season he's a very useful player if you're thinking of

him as the second baseman or third baseman of the future you shouldn't because he's not that guy

I will say my daughter was I think outrage when he played shortstop because she viewed it as an

imminent threat to france disco and I was like I don't think you have to worry about breprety playing

like a lot of shortstop but you do have to start getting your mind wrapped around like france disco

indoors getting older and his career and positionality is going to change a little bit like she was

very proud of his 300th home run on the last day of the season and the very short list of players

who have done that at shortstop which of course includes a rod who has like twice as many

home runs at other positions and she's very she wants lindore to be number one on that list is he

was he the only guy with 300 home runs in 200 stone bases yes Carlos Beltran has that as well

but obviously not a short stuff yeah well here's a complicated thing lindore's defense was bad

this year there's no two ways about it and it was bad in the weirdest ways mental mistakes

things that he never did before he was an elite defensive shortstop when he came to the team

he's probably a second basement fine great but we are all of our best prospects for second

basement well we just got to figure it out well I thought Rojas can play a little bit everything

I'm hoping he's gonna be a third basement because he's got power he's got pop I don't know what

his arm is like uh baby I think he should come back Mauricio I would love for him to come back but

there's not really a place for him yeah I don't know but when he I mean that last week you don't

want to read too much into it but he just comes up and starts mashing home runs every game I want

both the catchers back on the team mixture I just can't quit Francis Glover as frustrating as he

is just waving at everything within five feet of the strike zone and also a couple of the worst

ABS challenges like I've ever seen like I'm talking this is like a foot out of the strike zone

what are you doing man he's like bam I'm ready and like okay word that's it we lost our challenge

I'm hopeful that the coaching staff will be able to get through to him in the off season about

a couple of those things because it was ugly at the end of the season for Alvarez he had a he had

to find last three or four games but there was a 10 or 12 games stretch there where he was lost at

the plate making a lot of mistakes there were wild pitches that should have been called passballs

like he was sure he was all over the place and that was sad on the other hand former number one

overall prospect who's 23 24 years old a catcher with a pop like look long term this is gonna be tricky

torrents is really good yeah these may be the best fence catcher in baseball yeah

Alvarez is not a good enough hitter to DH I just we don't need to make this decision now I know there's

this weird thing though Zach where you keep like settling and accepting flawed players in your line up

and we can do this with more names on this list and then you wake up one day and you're like

so I feel kind of iffy about seven of our nine hitters every day and like we might be going into

that next year uh who else you feel iffy about as a hitter I don't know what bobe shed is

I'm optimistic about but I just I believe the track record I I think he like was a little

overrated and clearly overpaid I just like I'm a sucker for the type like I you know in a in a

analytics world of on base guys and power guys I like that he's just gonna now he needs to make

better contact and get more doubles and all that but I I liked that he's just a like a hit

just he's gonna get hits he's gonna it could be a huge bounce back candidate and have a

190 hit season that's totally possible it's also possible he's just in a different phase of his

career and if he is that sucks for us um so don't not worried about lindor uh I think we should be

mindful of offensive progression I think he's gonna be a 33 year old shortstop he's so streaky like

even when he we the last time we we did this time about he's all the way back he's at 299

home runs and then he just goes into these two week periods where he just cannot get a hit and

he strikes out a lot like I know he walked a lot which helped uh just sort of have the floor

pretty high but he he's yeah he had a weird area I think he was much worse this year from the left

side of the plate than he was the right side and then but a few years ago he'd been much worse

from the right side of the plate than the left side so he's even streaky in that respect where

there's no consistency in his switch hitting um can we talk about how you are digesting the

Braves Dodger series do you can you route I like to have a team that I root for in every series so

I'm rooting for the Brewers real gods illa versus Geeter is it rooting for the Guardians just because

they haven't won in forever uh obviously I'm rooting for Tampa Bay this one's tough do you have a

rooting interest uh I hope they all contract a terrible illness you know like I really just you

know I just I don't want any this is the joke in our house yeah so when Argentina played England

in the semi finals of the World Cup Croatia England have played a lot include there was a recent

seven nothing game which we were not going to talk about and Argentina was like everybody was

like sick of Argentina's index yes and so when they played motto was like my daughter was like who

you're rooting for and I was like and this is how this is exactly how would I have repeated

about Dodger's Braves so I think I'm rooting for everyone to get diarrhea on the field and for

them to have to cancel the game and just promote somebody else into the next round so in this case

everybody on the Braves and the Dodgers gets diarrhea that lasts for like 10 days they can't

play the series yep and so what happens in this case is Milwaukee and San Diego play out their

series uh-huh and the winner gets home field advantage is they have a rematch for the National League

Championship Series because the Braves and the Dodgers are disqualified due to diarrhea and the

winner of that series gets either five or six games at home that's their reward and the rematch so

that I'm it's funny that you said contract you know it's because that's exactly how I feel like and

I think that would be ideal you know I don't really want to either of them to win I'm rooting for

the Brewers I think it'd be nice if the Padres won that series but it seems very unlikely at this

point so the Brewers are an easy team to root for and uh you know the Braves are my mortal enemy forever

and the Dodgers I mean look if the Dodgers win if they win the World Series this year

it I think it makes the likelihood of a longer term lockout baseball stoppage more likely

and that's I don't want that so I have enjoyed teaching my daughter a little bit about

meds history and baseball history so she obviously not familiar with the Braves rivalry and

is vaguely familiar there's like a philly thing the teams don't like each other and so Dodgers

Braves to hers like a no-brainer she knows the Dodgers are bad we should not share for the Dodgers

or whatever and I'm like I honey like I we're gonna have to sit down and have this discussion about

the Braves and Tom Glaven and Greg Maddix and John Rocker and like all the Chipper Jones name I

told her about Chipper Jones naming his son Shay because he was so successful and Shay stated

which is like I almost respect it's a great bit it's a great it's a it's a good bit I was I like

like great bit um and I think I told you this when we went to the peak game we got there early and

we were walking around city field and they have those plaques memorializing like critical moments

in meds history and I don't think she was gonna be interested in like 1969 and 1986 we stopped it

every single one and she was like tell me more about this I want to know more about this like

this guy Jesse Arasco's like posters about the club and the one that she was most fascinated

about she's been telling her friends about is like the black cat game she just couldn't get over

the black cat game and just the cubs and it jinxed them and worded at this cat come from it's

it's been delightful so the Brave I've been teaching her about the Braves and why I hate the Braves

by the way she should can't can't believe the Tomahawk chop is still like I just need this

comment on a pod I'm just talking about this on a big picture episode where I'm just like

we're still doing this in 2026 come on uh Andy Greenback we're happy about that uh I I am I

I I like them seem to be fine I don't know I don't know what a manager really does other than

put people in the lineup and make pitching changes can you give me like a minute to talk about football

that it's related to baseball yeah absolutely I have no idea what's going on at football so

something happened um it with the jets this year that is very similar to what happened with the

Mets where I think there was a really strong case to move on from Carlos Mendoza after the 2025

season given the way that that season ended and what they did is they fired his whole staff

but they brought him back with a new staff and he got off to a really bad start and then they let him

hang around through the summer yeah and other teams that fired their managers earlier in the year

eventually turned it around like the Boston Red Sox the Philadelphia Phillies and they went to the

playoffs I don't know if the Mets were going to go to the playoffs if they had fired uh

Carlos Mendoza after this 12 game losing streak but you can make the case for it the exact same

thing has happened with jets where Aaron Glenn after his first season went four and 13 and he was

it's very clear he's not an NFL head coach he's been really bad they've in after that four and

13 season they fired all of his coaches he brought in an entirely new staff and they brought him back

the jets are more talented but they're one and three and Aaron Glenn looks way in over his head

and they're probably going to let him manage or coach the team through most of the season

and it's one of those really frustrating situations where every single fan

knows a person is not the guy and it's like Carlos Mendoza seemed like a very nice guy

and he did have that amazing run in 2024 and he gets a lot of credit for it but in every postgame

press conference a lot of the same tired like we got to take a look at it we got to be better tomorrow

we got to keep our heads up the same sort of like false inspirational language and as soon as Andy

Green came in he just felt like he was talking more honestly more directly more coherently about

what was going on you love to hear him challenging young pitching and love to hear him thinking more

dynamically about how the team should be playing and they played a little better I think it's a

little overrated how much better they played yeah they were like three games over five they were

like a borderline 500 which is like awesome but we would that's fine I would have taken that

obviously for the whole season and they were more fun to watch that final month than or so was

just much more fun to watch than the first three months of the season so but I do like him or at

least I like the way that he communicates with the press in the public which is a big part of being

a manager in New York and I think the young guys really like him and the truth is is that the future

of the team is in the young guys it's Benj and it's youing and hopefully it's Rojas and hopefully

it's Petri and you know I don't know if it's Billy Amix going to be here in Nick Moore Vito or any

of those guys but those guys a lot of those guys in the system they know him and so I am generally happy

that they extend it yeah by game nine of the completely inexplicable 12 game losing streak I wanted

the manager to be acknowledging that this is a crisis yes I was speaking of Benj I have two stories

and then we'll wrap up I have made my decision that Carson Benj is going to be my next and first

new met Jersey purchase and I want to road grade Jersey Sean you could not get a road gray Carson

Benj Jersey I went to fanatics official shop I went to MLB I don't want to order it from like some

knockoff let's say where I don't even know what it's like the meds directly I did I did indeed I was

like hey am I being stupid because I went to every official outlet and all I can see is home

pinstripes Benj I want road gray I have every other Jersey that I want to want road gray you're

like no you're not being stupid it's not available the only places it's available are you can go to

city field and they will customize any Jersey for you okay I city field open right now I don't

good question like I don't even know if I can go to go right now sure or if you go to there and

they directed me to this if you go to like the official meds merchandise website the very very

bottom where you would see like contact us about us just shit you'll never click on there's a little

link that says like request a product that brings you to a form where you put your name your

address and they can and they promise like on the form like we're not this is like not a guaranteed

thing that we're going to fulfill this order for you I assume this is where people can go to like do

crazy stuff okay so I just like road gray Carson Benj that's it I haven't heard back it's been

about a week I don't know I don't know if this form you're making a public here I told David Sims

our friend yeah and and he's his and I told you in his text which I really made me laugh was like

this feels like something that needs to be elevated to the commissioners off and I was like it kind

of does David has a Benjerzy I think he has white pins right yeah yeah you know why that's the only

one you can get yeah yeah if you want a gray road mark Vento's jersey available I'm good

I'm second second thing the power of sports in baseball I want to tell you to hold on hold on

before we do that really quickly we have not learned who the rookie of the year is oh my god well

Carson Benj should be I'm passionate about it so you know this is like this is the ultimate

Zach Low conversation when does it come out I think it's going to be is it at the conclusion

of the championship series so it's him in this first baseman from Cincinnati Sal Stewart and

weather hole and JJ weather hole in the car nose who was injured in the final month and no

on the claim who I don't get why he's just like not a can't do pictures just not get this award

they have before I think it's really strange that he's not in the top three right now you know

by many metrics either weather hole or bench should be the winner based on war based on a few other

things based on the fact that their games are more well-rounded than Sal Stewart Sal Stewart has

big round numbers 30 home runs 100 RBI and Sal Stewart is I think right now the the significant

betting favorite but there it seems to be amongst a certain quartile of the thinking baseball fan

community it should obviously be bench especially because of the way that he closed the season

versus the way the Sal Stewart closed the season which was quite bad he had a very bad last month

Dissy I didn't know that so like I look at their advanced numbers and their regular numbers and I'm like

wait like I and I know that Benj is war is like two and a half times twice yeah his war which I

assume takes defense and base running somehow into account us like man I can't believe like a guy

32 homers 11 RBI 787 OPS which was probably eight mid eights or low eights before this month

this is hellish month when when he was at 840 the case seemed pretty understandable and then I

think he only hit one home run in the last month of the season and had it like a sub 700 OPS that

and I'm like that that Carson Benj is just like by some advanced metrics just like way better than

that player I must not really understand the underpinnings of the advanced base running and

fielding just matters a lot but and also the at first base if you're a poor defensive player at first

base and that or those are your power numbers you're a little bit closer to the to the median

than someone like Benj with his numbers in right field and relative to you know I mean I don't

even know how many outfield putouts he had for the year but it was I think we're like 10 like

yeah he was double digits and he was like third in baseball yeah yeah so you've got these like

pretty significant game changing that dramatically I love contributes to war he's amazing I'm all

in he does everything well you play super hard right up until the end this is what one you over

to you texted me that he's gone super hard all the way to yeah Boston and I'll never ground out

and it would be really just a nice little feather in the cap just give us a little something

well and and the other thing that you get you can extra draping the draft these goofy rules I

love so like give us an extra draft it all nice give our scouts an extra pick we'd like to have

that right now wouldn't we we would all right that's what we need met's corner we'll be back at some

point we what's your story oh I forgot about that so just like this was a little hardwarming dad

story please month or two ago we we belong to this little swim club in in Connecticut it's not

fans there is no golfers or tennis it's just pools and whatever and my daughter's a million

of friends there and we're all hanging out there and then a birthday party happens now my

daughter's not friends with the birthday girl but the other friends are and she's the only one at

the club not invited to the birthday party and so like she's like daddy I know I'm not friends with

so and so but you know then she's like you're always a little sad kids get left out and they're sad

and like now there's nothing for her to do at the pool she's bored and cranky and we go home I was

like you want to just leave we'll go home we'll do something we'll play Mario Kart we'll do this

like we'll pass the time she had something else I have to do but I can you know being left out is

tough yeah even though she was aware like I I would not invite this person to my birthday party like

we're just not friends no nothing bad just not friends and it turns out the mets are on so like all

right let's watch the mets and they're playing either a Milwaukee or Tampa Bay you'll remember the

game I can't remember and it's an exciting game it's two one she's into it her move is improving

it's late in late in the game looks like the mets are gonna lose I think it was the bottom it was

the bottom of the eighth and she's starting to like we're running out of outs I'm saying I have

another mets loss uh Lindor gets on I think is on second they intentionally walk sodo to get the

bashed and I tell her I'm like this is a really interesting moment at baseball because it's kind of

a shot at the shed it's the other team saying like we'd much rather face you than this other guy

which obviously you would uh and bashed cranks are through on home at a left center field and the

look of glee on her face she looked over to me like that's that's what they get daddy that's what

they get for doing that to bobe a shed and and then she was like daddy I love how baseball like

things can change really fast that's right like we were about to lose and now we're probably about

to win and her whole day turned around because of bobe a shed hitting a three run homerun after

getting intentionally walked it was I just like to glee in her face the only other time I've

ever seen it quite like that was when she won her first ever swimmer's the first race she ever

got first place in and she found us in the crowd and was just like so proud and stared out at us

and the other time was when Croatia scored an equalizer against Portugal that two minutes later

was wiped out because of a bogus offside score so I was just thank you baseball and bobe a shed that's

all that's beautiful mets corner we'll be back uh something will happen things will happen hopefully

we don't mess things up Sean fantasy big picture you're recording and like 10 minutes you gotta go

I gotta go thank you thanks Zach good seeing you in person

all right that's it for the Zach Lo Show we'll be back probably Thursday this week for our second

episode of the week thank you to the great Steve Nash thank you to the great Sean fantasy

thank you as always to Mike Billy and Jonathan on production and thanks for you all for listening

to and or watching the Zach Lo Show we'll be back in a few days

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