Preseason Power Rankings, Part 3 | Group Chat

Hello, welcome group chat. I am Justin Varyer and joining me in the studio, Rob

Mahoney, Jay Kyle Man. We are here for part three. I don't know what that is.

Okay, cool. Or push the walls out. I got it. You got to angle it.

It's true. Yeah, definitely one of those. Part three of the pre-season NBA power rankings.

I hope you go back and check out parts one and two. We recorded those for Monday and Wednesday.

Are you guys ready for another? What? Four hours in this studio together? I'll closely

confine, get to know each other on an intimate level. Are we though? What do you mean?

I feel like I'm always, you know, trying to ask probing questions, trying to get to the bottom

of both of your whole deals. And I just feel we're I feel rebuffed at every turn. I feel like

I want you both of you to let me and our listeners in a little bit more. And I just feel like

I feel like I'm being held in an arms link. I think I'm a chronic oversharer. Are you? I think

Justin's. I think you would be the one. Okay. That is not. But here's the thing now that you are

the local here. We're getting like a preview of like you and your normal habitat. Kyle and I are

kind of on vacation life in a different like kind of timeline. That's true. We learned about your

style preferences. What your personal stylist has been gifting you your your taste and poor coffee.

Your sugar balance and your beverages. Yeah. You think a personal stylist is picking out my

coffees? No, maybe they should. Specifically. Look, I wish I had a personal stylist. My personal

stylist is unfortunate. Like for many people, the Instagram algorithm. And it has maybe a 7% success

rate. What would you say you're going for here? Sweater? What's wrong with this? I like it. It's

your problem. It's fine. Okay. Yeah. Arid out. What are your thoughts? You know, I think the fit

could be a little better. Okay. Wow. It's not just a drop of view. Jesus Christ. I don't know what's

going on there. Wow. Okay. Well, we're off to a great start. You asked for transparency.

I take so much back. I was like, I'm the one wearing the denim shirt. I think I'm also wearing a

band-toe shirt as well. So we've switched. We're definitely doing our early 2000s in the

rock. Maybe I'm just like being who I want to be and I just have you know, you know, you're

wearing a band shirt that's old to the point where people think it's a brand. Like people have no

clue that it's a band. That's a that's a fun one. The age yourself. All right. Are you guys ready for

this? I guess. All right. Well, first we have to take a quick break. We'll come back. Talk about

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All right. We've made it to number 20 on our list. This feels like the teams that like have a shot.

You know, we got through the end of the leagues at this point. These feel like the teams that

could make a leap at some point. We're you guys on just like these batch of teams we're going to

talk about over the next two episodes. I feel like that might be a little charitable. Okay.

Maybe a tad. Yeah. A shot at what and in the timeline of when they could have a shot at something

I think is what we would need to clarify. I think it's all relative, right? It's like where

these teams are coming from. Some of them have been in the dregs of the NBA for so long that even

getting to this kind of like near mediocrity feels great. Some of them have been to the mountain top

several times and being back here being questioned. Are you even going to make the playoffs

sounds like an insult but it's just kind of reality. Yeah. I guess I say that because I wanted to be a

Charlotte Hornets Optimus for this season. They obviously traded two big pieces over the off-season

in the Malibu all miles bridges. And I thought their formula that they kept would at least like lead

to a good regular season outcome. Like I wanted to put them much higher than they ultimately were.

They landed 20 in our rankings. My first like original question for this was would they win more

games than Lamello had averaged games played over his course of his career as a Charlotte Hornet

which was 15 and a half. And I was like I was ready to believe. But yet this was going to be a 50-win

team. I just thought that they clearly will talk about Lamello's impact and what they're losing

there. But I just thought like they're going to jack a ton of threes. I was a big believer in the

con Brandon Miller code jump together this year. I thought they brought in a lot of like steady

veterans. I didn't think they were going to fall off so much. And if anything I thought what they

had built already could carry into something beyond just relying on Lamello to drive their offense

or so much. Personally, media day yet again just pokes a little hole in there because con are

already out with a hamstring injury. Grant Williams also. It sounds like they're going to be back early

in the season but they might miss like a couple games at the very least. And so like that momentum

is really tough when you're doing a preseason exercise like this where it's like it's hard to

believe in a team when you're best second best player is already not expected to be there. I think

it goes deeper than that though. I mean last season for the Hornets was an incredibly charmed run.

Sure. And they won 44 games. And so expecting them to come into this year have to completely rewire

their offense without Lamello. Granted with very capable pieces as you outline Justin, I think it

was going to take some time period for them to figure out how they want to play how this works,

what the balance of it is in this new world. And thinking that that team is going to make a big

winds jump off of last year, I just don't think it's very realistic for this group. I think if

they're going to be more or less in the same place around a 500 team, maybe slightly better than that,

that's pretty good outcome for this group. Yeah. If you look at the trajectory, they've done

obviously in the, you know, moving over, they're washing away the Jordan regime and that in the

person, although Brandon Miller is as a holdover here. I guess he was right there at the end there.

He was instrumental in the Brandon Miller pick, but it ended up being, it looks like it's going to

be a big and we'll talk more about him in a minute. But I think in terms of the runway or just the

ceiling that this young core was going to have in the way that they played, you reached a point where

you were like, are we closer to the end or the middle? And I kind of, it kind of makes you wonder

when you look at the, from the outside looking at getting rid of Lamello, we can talk about the

impact that he had on their offense and where it'll go from here. It makes you wonder was,

was this a financial decision? Was this a basketball decision? Was it a culture decision? Was it

an even mix of the three? It kind of just makes you wonder, are they pruning a branch off? You

as the Gardner could speak to, if you've had this experience out in your garden, Justin, if you've

ever had to kind of prune a branch off of something or a limb off of something because ultimately,

you knew that it would pay off because I assume, that's the thinking I assume is that they thought

that this step backward would help them take more steps forward in the, in the near future.

You snip a basal plant at a certain spot, gets all bushy, grows even bigger. I'll tell me about

a brother and I think that's what they did. And so here's the good and bad with Lamello. Obviously,

fifth overall on offense last year. And a lot of that was just like the second half of the season

when they took off. And so like if they just carried that second half and had another half this year,

probably would have been, if not the best, then certainly among them this year, Lamello off the court,

there was good as the Kings last year offensively. The other side of that is Lamello,

as kind of what's kind of a looting to. Not a culture guy. Also, I actually don't entirely agree

with that. Okay. I think he's not the kind of culture guy who like makes everyone lock in and take

everything super seriously, but he is the kind of culture guy who can defuse tension in a room.

And so it's like there's, there's different kinds of culture guys, right? Like there's

ones who set a standard every day with the seriousness by which they work. And then there's culture

guys who help everyone else feel more at ease. And you can already see some of that in Minnesota,

frankly, where they're going from maybe taking things a little too self seriously sometimes in that

locker room in certain elements versus having Lamello, I think I think just has an error about him

that helps a team relax, maybe too relaxed at times, but it does have its place. That's what I mean.

I don't mean he's like a bad guy outside of like when he's on the road in Charlotte. Sure.

But like, oh, you literally don't. Yeah. I think it was an un-seriousness. They kind of like

exercised the Lucy Goosiness with both miles and him going out there. And I think the pivot they've

gotten to is being more of a serious team. And I think that's important for especially young guys

that they're trying to rear and like you want your best players to be the tone setters. I think

that is a kind of like sports cliche, but it ultimately proves true. And if he was the best player,

you're probably getting a trickle down effect from him. So there's that part of it. Also, they check

the second most three in the league last year. At, so they average 43 a game. I think that will be

the low mark for this team. And I think that is read like really fits the vision of that. And

obviously Charles Lee coming over from the Celtics. Yeah. There's a lot of roots in that offense too.

And so I think like what they were envisioning worked, but it is obviously going to require some

jumps from Khan and Braden Miller, especially as ball handlers. And so if he's not there, then it

just becomes a little trickier. Yeah. I think like the Lemella move we've talked about a little bit.

We're talking around it in a lot of ways now. I think the availability was the biggest part of it.

I think they liked him to a degree as a player. Yeah, maybe not some of the habits. Maybe not

everything he did on the court. But I think it was more just a calculated assessment of how much can

we continue to build around a guy who is only somewhat available. And Lamello's history, especially

with England, Juries is extensive enough now. You have to take that stuff serious. It has to be

the biggest caveat on any argument about what his basketball value is. And so if you're going to

have this intricately webbed offense with him doing a lot of con doing a lot of Brandon Miller

doing a lot, but the team also feels so stylistically reliant on the particular way that Lemella

empowers others. It's a tough safety net to lose mid season or for a month at a time. And I

think they just wanted to cut bait with that as much as anything. Who are the, well, I was going to

say the the biomechanics kind of people who like watch the draft classes. I remember I remember them

forecasting that Lemella might have some issues because of the way he jumps in the lane. He does a

lot of like odd footed float like floating forward kinds of things. And he's had ankle issues,

which yeah, has been interesting and it turned out to be true. Those concerns. But I was wondering,

you were talking about him having, I thought this was that was interesting, which you were saying

about him providing levity chemistry wise and how that can be value. And I was trying to think of

like who are the all time like levity chemistry guys in like successful situations. I mean,

Clay comes to mind. I was a good step. Steph is like that, but a different way. That's just like

a stability. Yeah. It's not yeah. It's like you can depend on steps. It feels a little different.

I don't know where it's like the goofball group. Well, yeah, in a way that's like helpful. I'm

trying to think of honestly, Dirk is a huge one. Forced. Yeah. Was a nice. Yeah. Love levity guy.

I think cat can be that in good circumstances. Sometimes he gets a little too raw raw. Like it

depends. It's hard to find the guys who are that all the time. Yeah. Because I think there's an

instinct. If you are the jokester, like you want to find a kind of seriousness or you want to be

taken seriously at a certain point in your career. I don't think a mel is really reached that

point yet. He's still just kind of that guy. But we'll see. I don't think you trade someone after

probably their best season. There aren't some. There isn't some stuff for sure. Well, it kind of

brings us to a central question though. Who will lead this team in this sys? So Lamello was third

in the NBA and assist percentage last year. And there's a big ol gap between him and the next guy

on the team I believe Kobe white was, but he only played a couple games toward the end of last

season after the trade deadline. Who do we think ultimately gets the lion share of this duty?

I don't really see there being like a huge lead. I don't see anyone carrying like a massive

assist load on this team. I really think it's going to be by committee that they're going to

continue to do this. And it's what's interesting is Miller and Khan kind of feel like sides of a coin

where they both, you know, they're both movement shooters. They both can get in the paint. I would

say that brain is probably a little bit more talented of like an ambidextrous off the dribble

passer. But Khan is probably a more steady decision maker. It's kind of like feel different buckets.

And you kind of have to make a call at some point. I ultimately feel like Miller is probably

going to have an offensive jump this season. I predict that that's going to happen if he stays

healthy. He's also had those problems. But he leans towards a preference to score a little bit

more in my mind. And Khan kind of is just like playing every situation a little bit more evenly.

And that's not necessarily a bad thing because Brandon is a really talented shot maker. But I kind of

feel like I kind of feel like Khan will have a slight lead in a by committee kind of approach.

Yeah. I think spiritually no one will lead this team and assist like Kyle is kind of alluding to.

It will be pretty balanced between the three of them. I think literally it's going to be Kobe White

who just in his limited time in Charlotte when Lamello is off the floor did play closer to

something akin to a traditional point guard. I think he will have some of that responsibility again.

But we'll have to see I mean I think it's pretty realistic that all three of those guys could be

five assist a game candidates, which would be a slight jump up. But no one's going to be in

the Lamello class of you know threatening to lead the league. Kobe career high 5.1. Yeah.

Do you think he'll eclipse that? I think I think he'll be just under maybe like 4.8 4.7 something

like that. That's where he's covered. Yeah. Oh the crazy thing is they lose the Mello and I don't

have much of a concern about the offense. See I don't I don't get that really. So right now you

think this team, which is again a lot of players we like you think they're going to be a top five

offense again. Not necessarily to the heights of last year but I think they're going to be a top 10

offense and I think it's going to be very good on they have too much firepower and it's all developing

talent like the fact that Miller still has more to gain. He's already like Jack and like eight

threes a game at like high level. He's taking 10. Like he should there's still more growth there for a lot

of these like highly talented guys and so I just there's just I mean there's good veterans off the

bench like I don't think the offense is going to be a problem. I think defense is going to be a

big concern. Sure. But I don't know. I think this is going to be what say eighth eighth best offense

in the league over under I I would take the under maybe slightly. I think they might come around 10

and which again like we're not far off really but I think the difference between being a team that

can be explosive enough to be the number one offense for even months at a time going from that to one

that's like comfortably in the eight to 10 range is a very different way to live right it's going

from blowing the doors off every opponent you play and your defense can kind of try to keep up

to now there is pressure on that defense. It's not just a matter of do they have the person

able to do it but if you're not going to be truly truly elite scoring you have to have that like

and that creates different incentives in terms of who plays it changes the shape of your rotation

it creates it forces you to make stylistic concessions if you're a charlesley. I just think the downstream

effects of going from one of the best offenses in the league to a pretty good offense are going to

have really tangible implications that are not super fun for the hornets. I think we could see an

interesting thing when you look at the player type here what I was saying like putting con and

Brandon next to each other with Kobe out there we might see a little bit of a stylistic shift where

we see a little more cutting where it's not necessarily as much about the like path like the making

creating advantage and then hitting the open guy as much as they they might get a little bit more

cutting offense with this because with the absence of Lamello they might have not as much of a

choice but to play that way but the thing that kind of concerns me a little bit is if you look at

like the downhilt like the driving numbers and the points in the paint and things like that I mean

Lamello was the lone beacon of light for them until Kobe came along which makes me think that

there's going to be a lot on Kobe to be like a consistently good productive driver overall I do

think that they're going to feel Lamello's absence in that in that sense because he he really bolster

them in that area. I just think that there are enough willing good passers on this team that the

flow is going to be there and Kobe wide has played like directly in that offense with lesser talent

and has done a good job playing this exact role and so like maybe they won't hit the heights of

Lamello but I still think this is going to be a good team it's just really to what extent yeah

I think they're going to be really good I think I mean the three point volume and reliance is

what going to be one of the stories of their season and some of that is not just because of who

they lost but who they're bringing in like adding Grayson Allen and Roy so Neil Nas as we talked about

these are really good shooters and and guys who are inclined to like Nas can be a really good cutter

is honestly a better ball handler than Miles bridges too in terms of like his ability to attack

and kind of get into space but he also wants to spot up and shoot and so it's like I think they

could fall into some of those rhythms where they're just kind of chucking and chucking and chucking

and it's going to work a lot of nights but also might get them in trouble I think that's a natural

place for an offense that is that gifted from the perimeter and that reliant on young playmakers

it's just going to happen sometimes well we think they're really good but with a they've regressed

I mean they were playing last year I mean we I just want to make sure we're consistent or do you

think they're taking a step back or do you think they're taking a stop side step or I think they're

taking a slight step back yeah yeah it seems like the most likely outcome I think a big part of it

is like what's going to happen at center I think Mousadia Bate was a revelation but clearly they

sacrifice some stuff by going to that specific type of center obviously they brought in our guy

Hunz Steinbach monster rebounder which I like as an offensive like just get tractor beam

beam hands yeah just get get the rebound kick it back out like there's like a certain synergy

there but obviously rim protection is going to be an issue outside of clockbrenner yeah and how

I can think how they manage those like four or five combos because Nas can play four or five

Moussa can play four or five it seems like honest might be able to kind of work with both of those

guys maybe more so with Nas frankly and so like who you want to play and how you want to talk

of that rotation is interesting I also am on the lookout personally for I hope Moussa starts

because I want to see him and Nas play together as much as possible and I'm in the market for a

duo nickname for the two of them I think like Bash Brothers miss like we can do better than the

basic stuff Moussa and Nas and the Mous is a little too drive time radio so like it's like Moussa

and what can what can we do with these so we don't have to we don't have to find a resolution today

but I want to open the conversation well what specific trait are you looking to really drill down on

is it the names themselves is it the physicality well here's the thing maybe maybe this is like where

you know if you like adopt a pet and you don't want to give them a name right off the back because

you need to get an understanding of their personality right it's like what am I really naming here

who are they going to be together I expect they're going to be fun and agile and super athletic

and dynamic and they're just going to be all over the place in the way that both Nas and Moussa

Dey have taken be if we can capture that that's great but maybe they try not to be something else

entirely you guys own mous hats not yet can we ask the hornets I would would wear one absolutely

they clearly like address this knee because this team was 27th in well I mean they'd shot a lot of

threes I mean the points in the paint was a small part of their offense they weren't great on the

offensive glass a ton of that was depending on Diabate yeah talkbrinner jumped out early and was

productive remember we talked about them on the show but he kind of regressed the season went on

they just need more avenues to get easy offense like that life is a little bit hard and uphill

and pressured and teams got in them we saw in that playing games where the magic just punct them

yeah and I think at some point you can't just be like a wispy shooting threes uphill team

you can't just I think I said this you want you can't just stand on the bank all if you're

gonna fish all the time you gotta get and you gotta get a line in the water and you mock me for

saying that but I think it's me sometimes the Kentucky just oozes out of you it's you know

it's a good was that in a crick or what are you thinking I had cricks ponds no that's why I think

the cutting thing is gonna become a thing for them because I just don't I think it's obvious

it's there for them because they just have these two great six seven six eight movement shooters

that you have to jump to the level and that's cutting game comes from that so I expect to see that

I think it's healthy and good to think of the Hornets right now and the Lamellotre especially

as the precursor to what they're gonna become and we want to see what Brandon Miller can do and how

he can pop we want to see the arc of john's career which is really exciting but also they are

now a team that over the next seven years they have three swaps they have five extra first including

the 2033 unprotected from both Minnesota and Phoenix they've so much to work with that the future

like leader of this team might not be on it and that's okay because everyone else feels like a great

piece a great potential supporting part there aren't any players on the Hornets honestly that feel

like they closed doors and so it's a really exciting place to be where you feel like you're playing

good basketball you're starting to string some things together season to season and yet there's

still a lot of doors open to you yeah if we're doing actions over words to steal a Brian

Winhorse Dism that trade signal that their future is in the future right it we they didn't usually

is for now yeah far away future they're thinking big view not short-term view which is what the

the walls were doing by getting Lamellot um any guys of things we didn't want to talk about conmuch

and I didn't want to draw your attention to this reddit headline that I saw yesterday okay which

was a video from the local Milwaukee news channel uh and I just love the way someone wrote this which

is conknipple spends the offseason playing basketball with his devout younger brothers Cajer

Kingston Cash and Kidman and his home court which is called the complex named after his father

big con so it's sorry the it's called the complex okay oh and that's okay rules yeah I was out

on Cajer but I'm back in on complex but the crazy thing is it's not like this NBA player millionaire

bought this whole like enormous great court for them it's just like outside their house that they

grew up it is just like a court I mean we talked about this before about the naming conventions

with stuff like this I do have you know I'm conflicted about cash mommy blogger naming style

you have like eight kids with similarly phrase names and starting names I yeah it's tough it can't

be it but at least conrose to the top you know I met the I met the knipples in Vegas and I have to

say they were quite lovely so I'm gonna sing sorry guys I was say K Kager his younger the devout

younger brother's part it's Kager I think so yeah Kager Oh I played for team hero and so there's

a the whole Milwaukee mafia kind of seen up there uh his brother built completely differently he's

like spinly sinewy like like a pipini type body is a brand of con is like so stout and everything

now I did the devout part I was like devout to who about the con about to the all just about

con was awesome last year we should say that yeah one of the thing that happened with the hornets

is they acquired rob dilling him and waved rob dilling him yeah and we kind of alluded to this on

a previous pod but I want to take you to down a bit of a trivial lane yeah uh drafted at number eight

wave just two seasons later the fastest that a top 10 pick has ever been cut by a team

rob dilling him is the second fastest that a top 10 pick has ever been cut who do you think is number

one poppy y'allness was really fast but he was 13 he he was just outside the range yeah it's not

mean it's actually someone who's come up weirdly enough on another trivia question on a previous

preseason powering yeah I guess Anthony Bennett Anthony Bennett 818 days of course the number one

pick by far the bullet the other names on this list in recent memory joe Alexander Thomas Robinson

Johnny Davis I mean just a whiff of all whiffs but it's just like on the one hand the fact that

they punted on rob dilling him does and and Ryan Nemhard we should say who they cut and the nuggets

picked up does feel like a vote of confidence in Christian Anderson right that he might be able to

give them something potentially at least some spot minutes as a shooter and certainly in Dennis

shooter who's a part of this team and rotation as well but man like the rob dilling him Odyssey

and journey is just depressing as hell I think should be a reality check around a lot of smaller

wispy guards especially ones who don't have a defined and marketable NBA skill that will surpass

all of the difficulty that they're gonna find with the size and athleticism of the league also it's

just feels like they're really falling in the footsteps of the solts and trying to be a more

democratic everyone does a little bit of everything sort of thing where they don't need a

de facto point guard if you're gonna go that approach you don't want more small guys there obviously

Kobe's not the biggest guy didn't shooters coming off the bench and so like if you're gonna

empower your wings like do you need small guards just like not playing defense so dilling him didn't

make much sense he did not he never really developed a superpower and I'll admit I mean I that

was a bad draft I expected Rob to kind of figure it out because he just such a creative I mean his

creativity and his he had so many boxes that were full of just craft and he was you know really

created with a live dribble and just the shooting never really got high enough to justify the

difference between him and Christian Anderson is Christian Anderson's elite shooter yeah he should

fit into the Hornets philosophy pretty quickly and he's a pretty talented uh are you all thinking

of Hans Christian Anderson I literally was thinking with hot with Honis and Christian Anderson

there's there's a joke here somewhere I just don't know what it is I was just thinking they might

take 63s a game because we've said with every player this guy is gonna get him up well yeah it's

interesting you all keep kind of I mean we circled around this talking about like criticizing the

tray heliomodel with the small guard it's just kind of like going back to the conductor insulator

thing like they have a lot of guys that the electricity the ball can move through and that's kind of

like you were saying that's it it's a formula it's a good way to build a roster because it's harder

to shut your water off if that's the case I mean there's a look at the Celtics like we'll talk about

them later like basically top five in both ends like this works we'll get to the like the high-end

works if you have a top five defense you know or in Jason Tatum yeah those things do tend to benefit

you guys trying to summon Bill Simmons what's going no all right next one number 19

ah they go over the state warriors this is just such sad shit I looked over the roster and it's like

this is it this is what we're doing guys I am shocked there this high and I looked back

through the spreadsheets I was like how did this happen I did not have them this high it's

respect no I found our culprit it's j cow man oh what did I do so when we file our individual

ballots for where these teams were gonna rank out Kyle had them as the 15th best team in the league

it's pretty high and whereas me and Justin are more like 21 yeah he's six spots they're two they're

two bad six spots is a lot they're too bad to be good and they're too good to be bad no they're

gonna be bad well I just I have I have so much respect for the the binary star of Dremond and

stuff that like that is a baseline of communication culture the problem is are we launching into it

what are we doing here uh uh Rob and I were talking about this yesterday this is a team that

is built on off-ball offense and cutting and things like that like the hornets might graduate

into or they if they follow that template I think they should but it they also have like prompted

more off-ball switching than any team in the league and in the past that off-ball switching could

be punished with talent that was around Steph and whether or not that's like punishing a mismatch

when they brought in Jimmy Butler that was a that was a great alternative if they screened with

Steph and Jimmy Jimmy could just ISO whoever it was to death you don't really have that at this

point you don't really have the shooting quality has come down you don't have supplementary playmakers

beyond Dremond and Steph um the options for how to help Steph or have things like ripple out from

the gravity that he provides are just not there and then defensively how good are they going to be

Jimmy's not going to be back it's just it's a myriad of uh of concerns so I understand the pessimism

you got yeah they just seem like a team that looks really shallow and frankly kind of cursed at

this point because yeah like Jimmy Butler was a perfect warrior and he's going to miss the majority

if not all of the season if he does play he's not going to be fully Jimmy Butler and that's just

the start of their injury problems and those are just the present injury problems because then you

look at the rest of this roster and it's a lot of guys who seasons need to be managed because they're

older guys who have chronic injury concerns across the rotation Steph himself played like 40 something

games last year I just I really don't know where it's going to come together for this group and it's

a bit of a bummer and it is sad and of course like I do believe in Steph and Dremond they've earned

every benefit of the doubt I just don't trust almost any other rotation spot as far as like what we

expect from what they're going to get out of their wings what they're going to get out of their

other bigs it's just so hard to predict when everything feels like a moving target feels like a

Jimmy Butler waiting game and whether or not he comes back earlier it's probably going to dictate

whether or not they even make the plan at this stage I just think like they can't even trade him

if they wanted to because the way their books are set up is Steph and Jimmy make a ton of money I

think they both make over 50 million and then it's like Dremond making like a reasonable amount like

20 something million and so like if you wanted to do anything you'd have to trade Jimmy but they

seem reluctant to do that and if you wanted to make any other move you have to completely gut your

roster of just bodies that you wouldn't be able to fill on the fly in the middle of a season and so

they're stuck basically the Jimmy Butler trade even though have re-energized them for a short

bid basically trapped them into their situation there and now to the point where like

Christopps would have been intriguing like well let's see what he could do he played a little bit

last year but then this offseason weird thing shows up again like I have to put where I don't want to

make jokes about it because something something might just be wrong with Christopps where it's just

like he this might keep him from playing consistently throughout his career no like it's not anything worth

taking shots at it's more just that they signed him expecting him to play he was a full go until all

of a sudden one day he wasn't yeah and so yeah we have no idea what's going on with that we don't

know when he's going to be available at this point it's just everything is kind of for grabs and so

I'm left looking at this rotation looking at this collection of players and just wondering not how

are they going to be good but how are they going to make ends meet how are they going to fill minutes

for 82 games with this group without just dramatically overtaxing stuff and Golden Seys clearly

trying to reinvent reinvent the wheel in some ways Steve Curry has talked about they're going to be

changing their spacing this year they're changing like the flow of their ball movement a little bit

they're trying to diversify what they do to grasp at something that isn't so nailed down but when

you do that you also make it harder for Stefan Dremont who are ingrained playing a certain way and

so it's like how much can you even rely on the parts of your team that work when everything else

how much has we got to do this they always go back to the same stuff that always works because that's

just like the heart of their entire thing the three guys who've been there throughout that's the

one thing that they've always settled on Steph Dremont and then then Curran so like they're not going

to change anything if you think about like though on like a night tonight you got you got to think

about the two NBAs that exist and the one the one NBA is the night tonight preparation thing

granted the familiarity of the warriors has passed into a this is not surprising anyone but on a

night tonight basis like preparing for them it's a little strange they play differently than anybody

else and it's kind of like that's good for a certain number of like it's a certain amount of success

and Steph has shown that he can still turn it on and spurt but like when when teams have time to

prepare for them it's just it's a different story we're seeing this postural orthostatic tacky

cardia syndrome it's not even know what that is it has to do with I mean it's it's has to do with

his heart I mean I don't know yeah but it's like I am actually oh yeah it's scary shit man

now I have a lot of time in the summer but he was diagnosed with this in Boston so it's kind of

like they signed up for this they signed up for older players they took a lot of risk to thread the

needle and try to extend Steph's window and the story is changing it's a different type of story if

you could expect Steph to be there for 70 plus games then we're talking about maybe shooting over

even these low expectations probably modestly so but then he isn't is available anymore and then

if he isn't available Dremont starts worrying about outline his podcast for the day and not showing

up as regularly so I just don't see a pathway for them to be like anything beyond mediocre this

season yeah I would believe it clearly if Jimmy Butler was healthy this would change everything

and even if Jimmy Butler wasn't but like Moses Moody was available it might even change their

outlook a little bit but we don't know if we're gonna see Moody until probably after the calendar

year turn and so then it's like yeah what are you getting at a porzingis what are you getting out

of Alhorford is this a season where Deantony Melton will be healthy or not even someone like Charles

Bassie who Bassie sorry I'm just going to quickly well let me put let me just like well to me he's

like emblematic of a thing here which is that the warriors are grasping at so many straws for like

oh can this player in some way fit our style that they have under indexed on is this a guy who

usually can play games and Charles Bassie like if he makes this find this actual roster is a cool

thing for a guy who has had major knee injuries basically every year for five years but like you need

guys who can play can we get the young guys the two way guys can we get guys who are eligible to play

games most of the time here's the thing the warriors aren't making enough moves to make players

like Charles Bassie not matter I think there's been a weird like over thought complacency about oh we

only have so many assets with this current version of the team with use them so carefully that it

kind of freezes golden states front office sometimes and this this off season is a great example where

yeah you draft yaksal linda bork he's gonna be really helpful for this team I guess you brought

in George Nien who now has to play what else was supposed to happen here like you knew about some

of these injuries going in you know where Steph is in his career he's certainly signing up V

extension to be a part of this for a little longer but where is the help supposed to come from like

I think the Charles Bassie thing yes I'm overstating but like you need to sign players who can play

games and I weirdly enough I don't think gold state is doing now the bass master is right wow I love

it he's ready to go we have a new mentioned Brandon Pajimski though is that is a guy that they

I don't know that they expected to be in the position to be defending depending on his development

all kind of integrity but I mean he's taking on more responsibility and if you listen to been our

our god been crews talk about it it's like any passive aggressive comment in the media that

Steve Kerr makes cruise will Texas be like he's talking about pods yeah so that's it's just

adds to the erraticness but I don't know it is is there any kind of a he said he wants to be

as good as Steph do we have any kind of like optimism that he's gonna make a big lead he's one of the

most reliable warriors and I mean that like derogatory you know like I this is the thing he becomes

such a weird lightning rod player because this team needs so much more than what he's able to give

most nights but Brandon Pajimski's pretty good I think that's totally fine he just should be the

six thirth seventh or eighth man on a team and instead he's a second cider essential personnel

captain to yeah you don't yeah if you're living in dying by I mean his like efficiencies across the

board it's just like yeah when the defense is like looking at all eyes on him it's you need him to

be in that role and it's he's kind of miscast if he's being asked to do I think there's a lot of

those problems here where like they brought in Brandon Williams this summer where a golden state

team four years ago brings in a guy like Brandon Williams like great a ball handler score who can

actually spell stuff who can like help some of this stuff keep moving when when Curry isn't on the

ball that would seem super useful it's just if you're missing somebody of the intermediate pieces

adding stuff on the bottom doesn't really change a lot yeah all right you mentioned yaksal

lindenborg I think before or after Charles Bassie I lost sight of what happened there um but

you lindenborg did it out at the gate linden on the breakout you got to know the lenda

can we leave this in that we're I want to counter for how many times we hear lindenborg this season

not from Justin it's gonna be chronic this could be a lot of the sad thing is I saw you guys laughing

I was like oh they really like my nasty joke I nearly nailed that one but we're gonna talk about

yaksal lenda board when I pointed you know you can do think about think about it linden star

trek mine you're you're you're loaning a borg some money lindenborg there we go lindenborg

there you go well we're gonna we're gonna get into their new lottery pick with the help of our

friends from sams club because this next segment is brought to you by sams club during the holidays

everyone's in a club the cool aunts club the not socks this year club the food coma club but every

season there's a team that earns its way into a club nobody expected so this segment is about

the newest members of the club spotlighting a teams newest offseason edition obviously yaksal

fits the bill there what's like a good expectation for him it seems like they might rely on him more

than a team with aspirations you'd expect right yaksal lindenborg is a guy who is older I think

everybody kind of knows about that but now because he had such a strange path to get to where he was

so he's gonna come in a little bit more physically mature he but embassable wise he's rounded out

his skill set in the past few years to the point where he's very matured ready to contribute in a

lot of different ways and I think that he is I would I would just prepare warriors fans for he's

a pretty clever connective passer he's gonna be a solid catch and shoot player I don't know that

you're gonna want him shooting like movement threes he can get to the basket the other thing too

is that he's a very very versatile he's gonna be a not totally vivid facsimile of what

Jimmy would give you sure I'm not gonna say he's gonna he's gonna just it's gonna be will that

piece of gumbh hold the water pressure for a amount in amount of time and I really think that

yaksal does enough things and he is so confident that he's ready to come in like I I think that he's

gonna fit into the warriors culture in a good way I think that means a lot that you're not

daunted to play with these guys for a like a franchise with this kind of reputation in this style

that a lot of young players have really struggled with but everything about yaksal's DNA as a player

in his skill set scream golden state and I think the idea that even if he is not Jimmy Butler

that you can have a player in flow who can do more than one thing golden state hasn't had a lot

of those guys in these role playing spots over the years they have specialists they have shooters

maybe the you know the Gary Payton cutter and defender types who really only offer you one

thing on offense when yaksal in the board catches the ball there's gonna be options open and I

think that alone is gonna really broaden out what golden state can do right now gizantos is

penciled in as the starter at least according to this depth chart that I just pulled up how long until

yaksal takes that with the overrunner is it does he have to take it though I mean why are we

throwing g under the bus I don't know if he has to take it I feel like they those two together

could because ghee offers a lot he's high energy player like he does a lot of things I think what

this is true I know it's just I feel like we're talking about like 10 10 day guys like they're well

guess what what half your roster is you support this player role players this is how we talk about

you know you nailed it with the decision tree thing though it's like when we were when I was

alluding to the not alluding to we're talking about like what happens whenever teams respond to

stuff that is a decision tree that comes down and when you don't have talent around stuff it's just

dead end and when you have like a yaksal who was a very productive post player in division one he ended

up being a great pick and roll operator he just the decision making tree is not a dead end when you

have a talented virtual player like yaksal let's think about it the other way too which is not when

will yaksal and abork take the starting spot but how much value is there and bring him off the bench

where he can also be a reasonable drain bond alternate in a lot of these actions you can do things

that the other supporting warriors can't and so if you need a secondary playmaker another facilitator

in some of those lineups he's going to be your man all right any other guys or things I mean can

we actually talk about geysan to us for a second sure I just think for a team in gold states position

getting him on an extension for three years 15 million is like low key super important their books

are absolutely cooked their a mess they have so much high in salary to get he was fourth in minutes

on last year's team weirdly important to everything golden state has going on and is like ballast for

this lineup and rotation just keeping him around a guy who is active and useful again the bar is low

but ballast one of our favorite words it is but geysan toes good the warriors keeping him around for

all the flag that front office takes a weirdly essential piece of business for them every breakout

squad has to earn its spot and during the holidays sams club is the club that helps you earn yours

whether you're part of the deal hunters club or the last minute gift givers club sams club has

the name brands you want without blowing your budget come join us sams club why don't we take a

quick break we'll come back do the rest of these teams absolutely now we have one more bit of business

okay I'm just I'm looking I'm looking to go and say it's rotation right you're real you're

going for something today was it was the sweater comment it did man I'm just trying to rest control

this podcast back from you no I'm just look Chris that's where zingas who knows what's going on

with him health wise outhorfered his season's going to be managed right George and Yang and like we'll

see kind of how much he ends up being part of this team draws bassy look I've already talked about

it our nation once again turns its lonely eyes to malafit leones I'm just saying he's on this team

great I'm looking I'm looking at who's going to be playing minutes I really don't see a way he's

not playing consistent minutes for the golden state warriors do you think Steve Kerr has it in

him to bury my guy maybe our guy malafit leones so they're both on train tracks Charles

bassy malafit leones yeah two different ones who you say then I mean leones obviously okay you know

let's get the oddity it just is it intrigues me you stick with the one you brought you who

brung yeah yeah yeah this has been one of your champion things this episode is brought to you by

noss energy every ounce of dirt sweat and gears every checkered flag and trophy raised every lap

every race every hard bought place they're all jammed inside every can of noss energy high performance

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so you've done over the years and I support you I just think if he's on a team we have to at least

mention yeah okay all right now we're actually gonna take a quick break we come back with

talk about these other three James this episode is brought to you by sam's club during the

holidays everyone's in a club the last minute gift givers club the cool aunts club the food coma

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make the most of the holidays come join us sam's club all right number 18 the Portland trail blazers

and the people of Portland have spoken they heard our call to have me throw out a first

pitch something that I just thought of in the moment as we were talking on a previous podcast

and the Portland pickles actually reached out confirmed that there are real thing on like Rob

was suggesting I just had questions and they want to have me throw out a first pitch at a future

game how about that how's that gonna go great throw a baseball how's your form what why are you

questioning this I've seen you play basketball have you have you really a long time a very long time

very quite long I've been working on my game you know those drop steps that I know some mechanics

you know I think I see a lot of like this with Justin I insulted Rob I might as well

and said just what's the mechanically sound just not a lot of much there I wouldn't say a guy

running around out there but there also wouldn't a lot of running around out there okay wow

okay I see a lot of kind of flailing finishes I don't know I used in the mix yeah I didn't

really play so I was just I was getting some cardio yeah you know got that do your thing but we

need to know about the throw hey is there any minor league baseball team asking you to throw out the

first pitch by the available okay well don't do that okay no teams out there don't ask Rob because

this is a special thing for me you're right we're ready we're ready for it and in fact I mean if

it all possible I would love for Kyle and I to be able to attend I would love to we can't go no

no but they did send us hats wow I was hoping that we could all wear them together for the segment

unfortunately they sent them after I had already lost angelus okay but I'll get them to you guys

eventually I'm gonna be wearing mine regularly because I'm a pickle die hard now rider die

pickler what's the league that they're in again it's a I think it's the American

no somebody said the name I just didn't know what yeah great fruit league yeah sure

we're not gonna do the name three guys on the pickles are you going to you don't worry are you

gonna be able to throw a strike is this like are you gonna be like 9-11 George Bush like right he's

gonna step out there like W I'm gonna be throwing slurves out there man you know okay I got a bag

all right well before not allowed to go we at least need to see video I mean you can come if you

want but I'm not gonna get you free tickets I wouldn't ask it for you know the bitterness is

in Christ you didn't believe in me as as a first pitch guy or the pickles why would we invite you

to lovely Portland we just wanted to know what was in your repertoire you know okay well I look

forward to to that happening and wearing a pickles hat on a future podcast but the Portland

trailblazers unfortunately I don't have as much hope for surprising I was actually one spot lower

than you guys on the blazers this year I mean we've talked about it a bunch I just the momentum

that they had last year I thought the plan should have been to carry that on allowed Denny

empower Denny bring in Dane maybe bring in some more shooting and just go from there especially

considering like Denny only has about two years on his contract left they can't reenact

negotiate and extend him because they don't have the money to do so now so he's just gonna be a

big ol' free agent two years and so like I feel like you this is the time you really want to be like

tailing Denny like you were the future they bring in jaw things just become way more complicated

for a lot of reasons we're gonna talk about and so I think they'll be good I think the defense

probably won't be as good as it could be yet again and so that's why I had them kind of in this

morass of West teams who like could be decent playin and if things go right maybe a little above

that yeah it just feels like everything is gonna have a trade-off to it and so you're bringing

more talent you are adding in theory some more shooting like having Dane back in a blazers uniform

on the court is gonna be such a cool thing but then you're making defensive concessions you're

making spacing concessions otherwise you're having to trade off in your rotation who you're

playing as you're supporting parts I just I think they're gonna be in a similar place in the grand

scheme of how their season turns out which is probably mid-off fodder yet again kind of like right

in that mix it's just hard to see how they're gonna chart a way out of that with this group because

even if things go super well like are you just you're gonna then commit to John Morant as like a

giant part of this team moving forward like what does that mean I have many many questions about

the Portland Trailblazers yeah I'm a little surprised normally you're like chugging the Portland

pickle brine and you usually you know I would say I was appropriately measured considering that

they were pretty good last year and I was all over it you were all over well I think you've just

chosen to kind of like turn to particular corners of the roster the timber of your voice when we bring

up the name Donovan Klingon changes it jumps a couple of I still think it probably will in this

conversation that's probably one of the little bright spots but I mean yeah you have you have

a coaching change here obviously so the the synergy between we talked about like you know Tiago

I don't know how much or little he was instrumental in the in the in the denny the denna

sauce what was that ever used denna sauce you just did there we go but yeah right I think you

nailed it I think in in courting the talent that they did in them bringing back Dame which

feel good story it's the concessions I think are gonna be an interesting thing in the guard the

dissonance among the guard group is gonna be one I could foresee that being a pretty frustrating

storyline for blazer science yeah well we just get into the essential question now which is I

ask you guys to rank these four guards based on your projection of overall impact at seasons end

so it's Dame Ja Drew Scoot um Shade and Sharp not available at the stage because of the injury that

he had which is unfortunate because you know he's making modest progress I think this was a very

big season for him with the blazers to see where he really fit into the future not gonna be around

for a very long time so those four guards where would you guys how would you rank them based on

what you see in the future what do you think Kyle thought about this is a good question thank you

thank you thank you guys I kept being kept just being like man and second guessing and I'm still

gonna second guess it overall like holistically what he adds in both directions we're talking about

the concessions and things the only player that really has the potential to answer both of those

and can see very little is Drew yeah Drew you know 36 years old he kind of started to decline maybe

that's a result of the just a assemblage of defensive talent that Boston had put him in a great

situation comes to Portland asked to do a little bit more asked to be a little bit more of a decision

like a heavy load decision guy I put him just in totality I thought that he would end up at number

one I'll zag a little bit here predictively zag I don't know how you all are gonna feel but I

think we might see a little bit of a jaw resurgence okay um he's still young we're heading into

the prime years I the frustration I mean obviously he was off the court for a number of reasons with

the Grizzlies and we kind of forgot and he forgot so it seemed or just chose to forget about what

made him successful he's driving the ball less the shooting fell off of a cliff I think that we

could get something out of him with this team with the with the paint touches and things defensively

it's gonna be a question uh third I think Dame's impact is similar to Drew's in that it's holistic to

me I have him at three um if he is willing to buy in to being kind of a not a purely on ball guy in a

way that's harmful to their guys developing or eating in a denny um and he's bought into being like

an off-ball mover as a shooter he's still an elite shooter and I think that he could help the team

and then fourth just by like as a victim of consequence a casualty of the situation I think

it could be scoot yeah it's good and scoot the the hard part about this is that like

scoot might be ready to do more and just not get the chance so I haven't met for it so I went

Drew jaw Dame scoot Justin where do you kind of prioritize these in terms of who you think is

kind of the biggest impact I have Drew Dame scoot jaw wow okay say I've jawed last

walk us through the jaw part because I like I'm I'm with Kyle that I don't know that I see

of resurgence but I think I think his individual production is gonna be pretty significant like

he's John Miranda I think he has to be just because of the way he plays yes they've already started

talking about him getting more catch and shoot opportunities which he's more comfortable for him

but like I'll set the public on fire exactly but that that's where you're at right you have to do

something with them when he's off the ball otherwise he needs to be on the ball a lot denny wants

the ball Dame wants the ball and so like I think that sort of overlap is gonna naturally lead to him

just like only being having a certain utility which is why I have Drew up front for the same

reasons Kyle did just like I think he's gonna be more essential they also don't have a ton of

wings so they're like they're gonna rely on him to play and guard up more than he was even last

year and he did a lot of that I just think injuries are just such a like a lesser story about him

because it gets lost in the mix of all the other stuff going on off the court it's just like he

just isn't available he's a wispy guard who just wants to play recklessly and when he's not doing

that he's just not playing at the same level that he needs to be and so I think the unfortunate truth

is that one of these guys Damier jobs probably gonna get hurt yeah and it's just gonna clarify

things for that reason and jobs probably the most likely subject there I mean Dame is pretty likely

too I like I'm not trying to wish this on anybody I genuinely cannot wait to see Dame back on the floor

but he is a 36 year old guard coming off of an Achilles tear and so likes to have the ball in his

face likes to have the ball in his hands even when he doesn't is a good mover without it that's been

a huge part of his game for a long time and so he's not gonna be the Damian Lillard that we know

and love is gonna be a different version of that guy and that player is gonna have to be managed

throughout the season I also think though that Dame's biggest asset to this team is just as

emotional IQ absolutely so like his leadership abilities and so I think if anyone's going to take

it back seat but be more willing to like allow guys to have the ball to play a less like physically

impactful style that might wear on you more would be Dame and so for that reason I think he's gonna

they're gonna have to pay some they're gonna be like conscious of it but they just need him to

shoot like if he just puts up shot like that is gonna have a certain value to this and when we're

ranking the value of these guards I mean the number one thing you can do if you're any of these guys

is play well with the other guards right and so that's why we have drew number one right there's

no ifans or butts about what he contributes less as like a lead ball handler more like alongside

jaw alongside Dame alongside school like he makes sense with all those guys Dame shooting does open

up those avenues and that's one area where jaw for all of the good parts of his game and how great

a driver he can be he does limit you to a certain style he does take certain things off the table

as those are looking to top he does kind of change who you want around him because you do have to

be very conscious about the fit and the spacing a couple or or three just sort of like stealthy subplots

here for this team that are new variables one thing that's beneficial here and you see this sometimes

when coaches change teams is that Mike and Norie has prepared for jaw extensively yes

deep familiarity with him that could be helpful in some way and I could see them finding some

that could be helpful and then there's a couple just basketball elements here that I think they're

adding to this team that they didn't have in the past number one is that jaw win bought in win

invested when focused is an elite paint touch creative kickout guy they don't have anybody like that

like not even remotely close so that's something that they could weaponize and then pick up point

one thing that Dame still has is he is one of the best deep shooters of all time that pickup point

threat is going to pull defense out of the center zone of the of the transition you know offense

and I think that's going to be helpful to their long athletes and then when he has the ball in his hands

it's going to change the geometry of the floor is he the same Dame of the past no but I think that

you could get creative I mean we'll see I guess I can't say that for certain but statistically

we'll say he will but I think those are elements that they could use and tinker with that they

didn't have like well we've seen the impact that that kind of spacing that like four point line

spacing for lack of a better term can have even if one guy is a real threat from out there and so

yeah parking Dame can be a real pull on a defense I think that can help I'm also very curious to see

the effect that jaw might have on the team's turnovers like the blazers were absolutely sloppy

like one of the sloppiest teams in the league in terms of their ability to spray the ball around to

share it to get into flow on offense they said no cohesive dissed all of that win.

Jaws best grizzlies teams were really low turnover teams and they had more shooting they had

a slightly different build but a lot of it was the creative kind of kick out that you're talking

about Kyle where he was such a good driver he's such a good improviser mid air and some of that

needs to change as his body changes over time but if he can bring their turnovers down to just like

a slightly more reasonable level by having the ball in his hands I think their offense can get

much closer to league average from where it was last season. I think the case for jaw is not only

did they not pay anything for him it was just Jeremy Grant and Chris Murray they didn't even

attach to pick to him which is crazy to think if we're to flash back three years or two years ago

with jaw just like considering his trajectory he was on. The other part of it is like what they

actually needed was the type of thing that you only get from superstar players which is what they

need paint touches they need a guy who drives the ball but also is able to shoot like they needed

to superstar creator and it's just like those guys aren't just growing on trees and so it really

they had to really like thread the needle on the type of guy they were getting I think if you're

also want to be an optimist you would say this team was very prone to shoot they just did not

shoot successfully last season I think you could see some internal growth from some of those guys

I think Denny in particular so he spent the first half of his season just basically being the

entire team and then the second half of the season hit dealt with the back injury didn't get

many up and when he did they looked awful I didn't even think he was going to make it in the play

in game but he actually started to kind of rebound into form as rebound regain form what what

what did you say I like rebound rebound he rebounded so like there's that to mind he's always

going to be you know touching go there they did I mean beat crazy we should mention I give

we're going to the guys and things I feel like I've named it I've mentioned it too much already

the crazy thing it's like he if he's done anything throughout his career it's shoot right and

shoot successfully he gets the Portland can't make a goddamn thing and so you would hope history

would win out there and he would finally be able to give them exactly what they traded for last

deadline yeah and so there are there's enough there that's workable it's just it's just how do

you deal with the overlap without sacrificing your biggest asset which is your defense so they finished

12 defense Lee last year I think they could have been way better they never really like clicked in a

way that I think that where they found a groove and they were dominating there like the start of

the season when they were going all wings with thigh bowl and all those guys Jeremy Grant it's like

there is something workable here that could be your identity they never really got there and if

anything you're sacrificing that by trying to work with these small guards yeah there's going

to be too much either or in the rotation decisions around those guys and that's one area where I hope

Denny can change shape a little bit in a positive way I think the reality is with Damon

jaw on this team Denny obdi is not going to be an all-star again like that's just probably not in

the cards he's not going to have the numbers the production the drive of the offense in the way

that he did to draw that attention to get awards consideration literal drive yes he's talking

to be really good and I think you identified something really important jv which is like his

shooting numbers I just fully expect to go back to where they were over previous seasons not just

because hopefully he'll be healthier but he's a good catch and shoot player he's just not a great

pull-up shooter and so if you can put him in more off-ball situations where he's attacking weak

sides but also just getting clean or three point looks that'll help and then as it relates to kind

of tying the team together Denny obdi was also like quite a good defensive player and when you're

asking him to carry the offense you just can't also expect that he's going to do full-board

defensive assignments all the time and so if he's sharing the ball maybe more of his energy

goes towards defense again and you can find some balance that way I thought what nori was saying

at the preseason press conferences was interesting on the one hand he's like we won't change what

Thiago did with Denny because what he did was successful he would be crazy to do that on the

other hand he didn't make a point being like we need to get him defending in the way that he used

to back in the wizard's days and he's right because he definitely like fell off considerably on that

and and so if there's like a middle ground there where he still gets his denny time to circle back

to like the bosh time of years ago like where he could be the empowered main guy plus be the defensive

like kind of stitching the things together sort of guy that he was previously like that seems like

an idea but that's not an all-star and like if you've seen that you could be that player to go back

to that is a really hard step yeah it's it takes a physical toll on you to play the way that he

played I don't know here that he was let's see first in the league and drives per 100 possession and

third in the league and personal fouls on drive so he's getting hit a lot we're talking about the

blazers just they could get to the door but they just couldn't walk through it and so many different

you're talking about the decision making tree they were you the this is this is a wild stat they

were fourth in the league and presented to the time that they got paint touches 66.6 and they

were 30th in the league in points per chance when they got to the paint so this is a team that

relied on ramming their heads into the wall and creating offense that way and you're getting

into some of these playoff teams it's just an inevitability in a reality that when you see a

victor win minyama or whoever it is like or Chad homegren that those are the questions you have

to answer if you want to level up be serious the grifting is going to be an all-time high which is

what kind of was basically implying that Danny got pretty bad at it it was like it was tough to

walk if you're getting like called out in public by other NBA players on a frequent basis I mean

these guys are all trying to protect their livelihoods on that do we want to talk about the

rule thing that was tweeted why not see how much does that affect any I mean to speak to this

detailed that the NBA tweeted out with a great presentation of clips that they were going to cut

back on arm-barring in the paint which is chronic among superstars I mean they they let they

mysteriously omitted one person from this silent reel of examples what do we want to name names

I would say this is shane's not in it Danny shea jalen brown jalen jalen was in it well I'm

just saying as far as the prime culprits she wasn't in the video not at all wow I love shea but come

on man pretty interesting it is pretty and I love shea but it do what I mean do we have anything to say

I mean it could have a tangible effect on his play I just think with like referring points of emphasis

too often we have seen they are called that way for one month and then everyone forgets and moves

on so I let's let's check in come December and see if this is still what's your point of

emphasis at the beginning of every season that you say we're cutting back on this that it but in

like a month's time you're back what's what's great what I mean honestly take out once the game start

like I'm so focused on doing push ups and stuff in the morning or the season starts

they're like me right now you know healthy will you be can we sustain it just on the pickle diet

right now yeah that's right I do think some of the grifting from Danny will be counterbalanced

probably from the dark arts of the superstar calls from Damon jostle perhaps there's like

some balance there yeah but I will say like in addition like some of the other moves they made

this off scene I thought they were all like golf claps like oh I like that guy like my kappa

I like a potter too Brandon Carlson a guy whose name I will never be able to say because I always

think it's braiding Carlson or Brandon Carlson we're just students namely guys at this point

that are these you have are those real factors these are guys and things I kind of think

Mike Potter play yeah especially what made the stretch they that's the thing when they get into

those real like mudslide games and they're just they cannot get anything going and they just start

taking bigs off the floor Mike a potter can I'm not going to say he's a great five but you can

plausibly put him out there for a couple minutes and not get absolutely roasted and so I would be

shocked if he doesn't factor in it's like a change of pace player for them sure I have I think

they have one of the best big man rotations in the league because not only did they bring

Rob Williams back who's probably if not okay among the best backup centers in the league let's

rewind you think they have one of the best big man rotations in the league yeah donovan clingen

Rob Williams Mike a potter young Hanson well Carlson too and Carlson I just that's why was the best

big man rotation specifically referring to clingen and Rob because Rob is the back backup center in

the league clinging and Rob are the you hate clinging clingen it's a good player and when you stop

talking about it like guys are just so polarized I mean I can't tell you how many like advanced stats

like tweets I've seen just being like donovan clinging best player in the league like dominating

on both ends like perfect shot diet of threes and just at the basket because I just like you know

the shots you realize some teams have like victor weapon yama on that right that's automatically the

best picture weapon yama luke or net is better than this I don't know what to tell you even

even like me instead of luke or net that's why I qualified it as rotations not voting

I'm worked up Rob's get me going to say clink calm if we were just saying this is the best center

in the league yeah I would not bring up donovan clinging that's that's restraint which is why I

said rotations which is a different call I appreciate donovan clingen's good Rob Williams is good

I like who they have them who they can kind of toggle between and rotate between um their good

options to have for the blazers would you rather have a rudy go bear and yo on barren jay or

rudy go bear and yo on barren jay that felt like a distance it's close because barren jay are

reassuries it's who we think it's everyone's gotten over their skis on barren jay he seems like a

really interesting prospect we'll see if he comes in is a good NBA player oh no it's really not

close because rudy go bear is a very good player again we're just focusing on one player we're talking

about two guys I think if you're center who's playing 30 cumulative points you know if if

rudy has a hundred and barren jay has two that like you still have 102 right but you might not get

to the same points total of rob and clinging if they're both like 60 I don't think that's how it works

yeah it is it's cumulative I said rotation not player yeah you jerk if rudy go bear is playing

30 to 35 minutes the nuggets in a rotation also pretty good that's still not all the minutes in a

game so what you're saying is that the blazers have one of the best backup centers in the league

best center rotations in the league I think that's incredibly generous to database you're now just

nitpicking the like the specific verbiage immune that's what we do here is it no that's what you do

I mean also fair anything about the blazers I want one let's let's let's bring the temperature down

you started shouting actually you know what let's not bring the temperature down let's redirect

it somewhere else I think that's the important thing here uh my can or a very famously brought in

as the head coach of blazers with one guaranteed year under contract absolute dog shit stuff as

far as hiring a coach goes but more than that hiring a coach with one guaranteed year to coach a

John Merrant Damien Lillard reformed team on the fly I just think it's like a real tough ask for

like I can see I'm not trying to take my can always legs out from under him but like

getting to lame duck status with one guaranteed year is a really fast path and I hope my can

or against a real chance to do this I hope everyone is kind of on board and trying to be their best

selves in a part of this team but there's a version of the blazer season that goes absolutely

sideways and he's the one who ends up taking a fall for it and I don't think that's particularly fair

man the head coaching swipes and opportunities are just really hard to get yeah man you know he saw

this and so saw it as a chance to bet on himself I guess but you're right I mean it's a it's a

tall mountain despite the the pieces that they do have we don't need to get into the ownership

stuff but yes obviously yeah it's it's not great and better than it was but still not great right

or is it just that they placated him so baby's not crying anymore is that kind of yeah as as we're

recording this I would say the temperature has turned down considerably mostly because they're

doing all these negotiations and private and thus they're being more careful about putting a

positive spin on that when they give statements about it they did make come out during media day

their team president basically say that they wanted to be in Portland so they're saying the right

things now which is a step in the right direction because they're actively throwing the city under

the bus so the deadline is in December to come up with the deal they gave them a whole ton of

public money in order to rehabilitate a totally fine arena and so I would be surprised even if like

from a business standpoint he didn't just take the deal because it's a pretty sweet deal and it

seems all he cares about is just bleeding money out of his loyal taxpayers so they still got that old

monitor up it that big jumbo tron that you pointed to you were like look at this piece of shit

that's still in there I don't remember saying that but they did they did change that last year

I thought that had a charm to it I don't like the older arenas I think as character but I guess

if you're trying to core sponsor some people in sweets like that's not what they're looking for

we're also obsessed with analog know why not just have a huge cathode ray up there

it's just a big record player why are we even messing around prime time was totally in 4.3 and like

down why not let's do it and they just complain about like oh you won't get like touring

like music actually that has nothing to do with the blazers who are renting from the city now

because the city owns it doesn't make any sense anyway all right number 17 the Atlanta Hawks

probably the biggest benefactor from the okc trickle down effect that we've seen the hornets had

a little run there with mechage and tray man but the hawks basically just got two really good

rotation players for virtually nothing I do like the conspiracy theory that the thunders specifically

sought out the hawks because the hawks give their pick to the spurs and they're just like we want

to take the spurs down a peg can't imagine it's true at all because the hawks play this way and they

prioritize defensive minded wings and so like a guy like ludor makes a ton of sense um but I think

it worked out pretty well for both parties yeah I mean just being able to scoop up some of these

guys for a team that was already pretty deep a great coup for the hawks they're gonna be a really

solid team I don't know that they've addressed kind of their fundamental issues though like they

were lacking for half court like star level shot creation when seagymacolum wasn't walking on water

and they still are kind of in that place I think they're waiting for can jalen johnson take a jump

in that way and he doesn't particularly seem like that kind of player but sometimes guys just kind

of turn over a new leaf as far as like a little bit of a mid-range one-on-one game yeah this team's

going to continue to be just a colossal pain in the ass like if you're a ball handler in the east

the switchability on this team is going to be holy smokes we're adding door to dyson daniel's

one of the best I mean we can talk about him more of it um adding that to him and then but jalen yeah

not just him like nikeel king's the fun he's like they got dogs out there yeah and I mean they

they tried to address some of the the half court stuff with like all the guys that they passed that

they uh just a 40 and slip there they that they drafted and brought in Henry Bay sorry the guy

that they picked up later in second round in torus acl so he'll be out but they can all pass the ball

I think the big thing is um we saw in the playoffs that the nicks kind of figured them out once

og just kind of started picking up jalen full court and and and it just kind of forcing him into

traffic he's got a lot of things he his arc to me is similar to buzelis where he needs to get a little

bit lower with the ball on traffic he's going to have to add more pull-up game that's dependable

shot it decently on catching shoots um I guess a big question is just like how ready is kinkston

flimmings to come in and be a part of this this team because I think he's probably the most clever

aside from cj like on ball processor and the heck worth that they have which is I don't know

if it's a compliment to the existing roster but you know it's going to be a helpful thing for them

depending on how ready he is well there's been a little more speculation than I would have thought

about who starts for this team especially at point guard like do you start cj as he was in the

playoff run do you start and keel there which lets you put even more defensive wings on the floor

maybe ludor first among them and you could just start kinkston flimmings out of the gate if you

feel like he's ready to be fast tracked in that kind of way because it depends on can you count

on flimmings for the offensive side there because at the very least you can count on cj to have a

steady hand in an offense and it just doesn't feel like there is at this stage someone to turn

to beyond him like you need a conductor for all these wing heavy guys because jalen johnson just

feels like he needs someone there to it we're very least like ride the little car in next to him

and like make sure he's like pointing in the right direction side car yeah the side car

but you could also wonder has the magic worn off from for cj i mean like i thought last year

was a pretty miraculous turn of events considering where he is at the stage of his career i thought

he was done when i got traded by the wizards but they brought him back and in the hopes that he

could at the very least try to reprise what happened in the playoffs i'm not so sure but they have

a lot of options and i wouldn't be surprised if they turn to them very quickly yeah i think

the options they have as far as juggling basically every part of the rotation is what makes the hawk so

exciting like if you want ludor to be your primary starting defender against the superstars of

the lake you could do that but you already have dyson daniel's and so do you bring ludor off the

bench does that mitigate what he does well does it open up some other part of his game or something

else in the rotation i just think there's there's so many choices that have to be made in a way that

honestly is like kind of dizzying like this depth can sort of cut both ways where it gives you a

lot to work with but it also means every game out you have to make so many active decisions about

how to manage this group to the best possible effect well let's get to the question i hand here

which i have down is one is a land of the deepest team in the east and two i'm wondering how much

that matters as the top of the east becomes better more star driven like will depth matter as much

if the quality of the teams are going up against is a little deeper i think about a lesson

in terms of the end game and more about how do we get there and so i would say that the hawk's

depth insulates them from the kind of like disaster or near debt disaster scenarios that would

take one of these eastern conference contenders and just like knock them out of the race they're

going to be there like the hawks i feel i feel more certain about the hawks placement and i think

we all do because this is one of the few teams we were in complete agreement on in terms of our

ranking that like we know where they're going to be and we know where they're going to be because

even if cj misses time even if the keel misses time even if jelene johnson misses time they have

so many pieces where they're going to get through the regular season i just don't think it's going

to help them beat the nicks and the sixers and the Celtics and the pace like some of these other

like really the even maybe the heat at that point who they are in the playoffs to me is a very

different question but they're going to be so rock solid in the regular season that to me is

a tribute to their depth yeah i think they're going to be in a in a good kind of middle because of

that depth because we're talking about all the it's interesting we're talking about all the solid

kind of choices that they're going to have but also still a lot of questions to be answered

if they answer those questions in the short term it'll be interesting to see how this year goes

but i think we're all kind of in the same spot where it's like the star power isn't quite there

but i think that they're probably going to be in a similar position that they were in last year

where they just kind of scared the nicks and forced the nicks to kind of figure out their shit

maybe they credit them for that i don't know but i kind of expect because they were so easily

solvable like i was saying it's like the and i was like revisiting some of those games in the playoffs

against the nicks it was like once they solved them yeah those were some of the ugly it's

why all games i've ever seen so we'll see if they get the handcuffs cj and the basement and that

was really it the whole hospital there's just like there's no there are no utilities in this house

anymore yeah yeah i mean we see it time and time again it's just like team that just have waves

of guys they could just withstand more in the regular season it's just like it's been a

truism about the mba for a very long time at the regular season the playoffs are a different style

of basketball but now it just feels like a completely different game and the divide is growing

seemingly by the year and so i guess my question ultimately is like we think they're going to be

rock solid but then can they take a pacer's like leap where they take that strength and turn it

into the sort of thing that overwhelms some of the star power that's forming at the top of the east

like if they're going against a team like the raptors for instance who all of a sudden has a lot of

horses up top but maybe don't have the depth like can you dominate the minutes where they're going

to their their second units and that just becomes such an overwhelming advantage at the very

least like you're getting farther than people would have expected maybe not the finals maybe it's

the second round maybe even the eastern compromise i think the variable there that they don't have

is tyris albert like they don't have that high-end catalyzing style like setting kind of player

i'm gonna dig in here i'll let you finish no no let's hear it i'd like that you said that uh the

more i've been just sitting here and thinking about it i'm just gonna put my money more of my

mouth is i think i think that flimmings is a force multiplier like i love that i think i i think i

really have a lot of confidence in that kid because he's very bright he plays a style that is

extremely early point five like sort of yeah it's a taste i'm do i'm snifftering uh because it's

just the thing in basketball that i you're a rookie sommelier so as soon as we start really getting

into it it's it's the thing in basketball that i love the most it's like that that early point five

sensibility where guys just and and he was such a tactic he was the best guard at summer league

in terms of like his half-core tactician brain and i think that he's gonna be mature enough to come in

and like he doesn't need to score a ton of points but it's very halibut and he i've said it a lot

about him that um i i i really think that he's gonna impress people and i think he's gonna help

this team in the short term i can't i didn't i didn't mean to step on no no i i would love that

outcome for them and that's kind of again the wild card element that they're missing the guys that

they're picking up from the thunder the other elements of this rotation yeah jalen johnson's popping

off nikell examiner is still growing x-inter walker still growing but it's like we know who

errant wagons is we know who ludo door it is and so what is the mystery element here that could take

them to the kind of different level or outcome you're describing just and i think i hope it's kinks

and flamings that would be that'd be really awesome to see the flip side of this if flamings doesn't

become that player they're obviously suited to swinging for a star trade if it does become available

it seems like that's happening less and less these days like we had a very active offseason but like

in the midst of a season like guys who are like gonna change the impact of like the trajectory of

the the title race just doesn't seem like it's happening as much and so i'd be surprised but like

they seem suited for it all those wings that they get from the thunder they could just package

together here short term deals players that will get you by and then we'll just give you some

prospects and picks and like we'll go from there i don't know i don't know if that's the way

the league works anymore and i think that's the flip side of this where it's like teams that are

successful build more like the hawks than they do like the big three he and so maybe the model is

to just find a guy in in lower in the draft and all of a sudden you just made the right pick it's

just to pick well rather than to attract a guy to a certain market yeah so i don't know any other

guys are things we just talk about nikeel yeah we probably need to talk about some of these core

guys more than we get into the kind of the deeper cuts i mean nikeel even the fact that we're

talking about him as the potential starting point guard of this team but also can be a wingstop

or also is an incredible offball mover he he is kind of the rosetta stone that makes a lot of

this possible like jalen johnson is incredibly versatile and we talk about that as a playmaker

and a defender and kind of a shooter and kind of a slasher but nikeel moving around the floor

and all the capacities that he can't especially on offense i think it's what makes

like like allows you to talk about kinks and flammings in a very realistic way as a starter allows

you to cover up what some of cj doesn't do well what they found in him i'm like son by even still

like seeing it was just one of the great development stories in the mba year over year over year

and a guy i love watching on an ily basis uh yeah just an incredible shooting leave i mean one of

the best that we've seen in recent memory i guess the question is going to be like is what it was

that a momentary spike or does it continue i i i think it will other thing we should talk about

is disandain you're speaking of shooting anything like sky can contribute offensively

can we count on him to to to be able to shoot the ball see i think this is one of those things

it's like it's so glaring when it happens but on balance i don't know that i buy it like i think

i think their offense is fine when he's out there and he does a lot of in between stuff but it

does i would like i would like him to shoot yes to take shots whether that's little runners in the

lane or three so i tried that i know that i know that our first took over he was like give him the

green light it just but it's it's the only option i guess refusing to take them is not an option

and so i i think it's one of those conversations we get into a lot because when it gets picked on

it really gets picked on but by and large i'm just not as sold the disandain just as like i

a huge huge negative on an offense i think he's a fine acceptable palatable piece that you can

work around for the most part but that depends on on yaka kongu being a real deal continued shooter

continued factor like you can't have multiple of those guys 20.7 on catch and two threes last year

for dice and it's not good he's not a shooter yeah the problem is now that if they have options and

if you're getting into more high leverage situations if you're getting to the playoffs it's like

you're more likely to pull the plug in those sorts of situations like you've totally fine

in between sort of guy but like we're leveling up the hawks and they need to make the most progress

offensively so all right last team on the list here number 16 the Utah Jazz I would say we're

coming off the fumes of the post-daren-peters in summer league we're like jazz about to win the west

I think we got a little over skis and we're all culprits in that the trade for walker

Kessler I would probably do 99 times out of 100 they just got completely bold over with a package

that I don't think you could say no for for a player wasn't available and really hadn't played

to the level that the Lakers are assuming he's going to this year having said that big old void

on their defense at center and I just don't know how they plug that unless they like make some more

moves in order to do so obviously Jaren Jackson's going to help there but you're counting on

use of Nirkich as your starting center and as fun as the use of Nirkich triple double like

yeah that helps your offense which I don't think they're going to have problems with considering

how much juice they have on that end the defense is probably going to be pretty well I think this is

another thing I'm kind of reaching for a term to describe this very specific feeling of you're

talking up this under the radar thing that's happening and then all of a sudden that player gets

cast in a way too important role and nothing feels good anymore this is just too much use of Nirkich

like I'm feeling real like bloggers remorse over this whole situation usage yeah the use of usage

is going way through the room and so you're right like they probably were planning for Walker Kessler

to still be the starting center on this team even if the extension talks were a little dicey or

whatever it was looking like at this time but you get bold over by that offer you make it and now

even though this is the year where the guard rails kind of come off as far as the jazz being a

competitive team they do have huge considerations on defense that they now have to manage and mitigate

and figure out how you're going to do this like Jerry Jackson Jr. cannot be a full-time defensive

five like that's not really in his I think more than his rebounding skill set to do as much as

anything and so you just are just going to play it's going to play a lot where will that leave

Utah's defense overall I'm really not too bullish on it but I still am so excited about this season

yeah I mean you just assume that they're going to bow a lot and have a lot and like play more for

deflection because I mean Jaren Jaren naturally has always struggled with that but he's going to be

away from the rim this is a team he split his time over the he's always kind of split it a little

bit leaning towards the fore and played some five but like you were saying full-time five offensively

that's going to be amazing for them I mean they're going to just I guess lean towards outscoring

people a lot of the time I really have enjoyed the social clips where maniacally Will Hardy is like

not did you see this where he's not allowing them to see the he sets the clock in a practice if

people have never been to like a college or a pro practice or even high school practice coaches do

this they'll set a clock for every individual task be like all right we're working on the

shell defense for 20 minutes he kept resetting the clock like so that they didn't know when the drill

was going to in basically so to control their effort which there's just a little thing I should do

that on this pod I enjoyed the yeah just this of how long we've been podcasting there's no in so

don't there's no phoning it in or winding it down whatever but um they're gonna they're gonna

score a lot of points man I mean it's gonna be it's gonna be fascinating see and like I said if

they if they do approach you know rekindling some of the like nercage fulcrum action kind of

magic that he had with Damon C.J. having him on the floor is gonna be they're already doing that

with kiaontay like they're already tapping into some of some of that part of his skill set which

has been quite useful for the jazz we say that we're tempering our expectations and yet everything

we've said is just mostly glowingly positive especially because like as we're looking at the rankings

we have them 16th in the NBA coming off of like a pretty disastrous run here not just last season

with the past couple of years have been really bad uh that puts them seventh in the west which still

feels that'd be awesome pretty high yeah kyle had them even higher you had them 13th overall which is

just slightly higher than we had them yeah it's just hard not to like what they have you know

she's like so much fun dynamic skilled offensive players yeah there's the individual player elements

which is just like I want to watch Darren Peterson play I can't wait to see what jaren is with

this particular group we just don't get to see enough lorry market and anymore because they've

been kind of holding him back from selective injuries and slow rehabs and all this stuff that's

what it is I think is the jazz have been so bad and they've been worse than they had to be and so

this year as much as anything is will hearty taking some of those guardrails away and this is just

like let's see how good these guys are let's let's see the offense has been like schematically

interesting for a long time defensively I think it really has depended on the group that they had

this year I expect to have its own problems but it's a team has been consciously holding itself

back for so long and I just want to see the jazz kind to go for it for once and that alone will

be worth the price of admission I um I would I would extend the defensive thing you're talking about

their concerns even further it's that the bookends of this defense are going to be rough potentially

because you're talking about the rim protection I don't even worry so much about that is

I worry about this team guarding the ball in a real way in a in a Western conference it's

full of talent to ball religions going to league that that's one of my biggest concerns for them

and that could just have like a cascading critical effect on their defense I mean on ball defense

I think markinan is their best on ball defender at least in the starting lineup and then when you

get into the bench it's probably like Josh and Kogi or something like that um but like Kionte

like point of attack yeah Darren Peterson even Collier of rice sensible like these guys some of

them will try harder than others but nobody is really stopping anyone in that group yeah they

brought in Josh green and the trade with the wolves but that was always my concern with this team

is that like yeah this could be scintillating like scorcher eyebrows on every possession with

the two guards there but like who is going to be playing they don't have that typical 3&D guy

and I don't know where that's going to come from and so this probably feels like another like step

up before we make the giant leap forward but just to put like a pin in like how long it's been

in this wilderness where you're like oh they could be good if they wanted to if they just tried

which like god forbid a fucking NBA franchise one of the 30 tries playing competitive basketball

that's going to be fun it was four years ago when Laurie Merkin and made the jump made his first

all-star team yeah four years and we basically been saying like oh he's great he's great but like

they have to put him on ice we have to come up with injuries like just it's like he's that must

suck as someone who was like ready to like play competitive basketball and be one of the best players

in the league just like kind of having to play a waiting game yeah I mean some of that's the decisions

that they make right we're talking about that with Devon Booker about what you are signing up for as a

player right Laurie did sign up for more of this and so maybe it's longer than he expected but he

did opt in thick hour he's going to be in the locker room with his headphones on it's my love it's

now won't it he does seem like a mid late bond jovy well brings us to our question I not

the singing but I think you want yeah please a couple couple other bars maybe a bridge

both the jazz have an all-star the season and if so who I don't like so no I won't win enough

I think mark an in is going to be good and it's like inconceivable that he could make it

but I think they're going to be one of these teams it's pretty good and they're going to have

several kind of candidates who are going to hedge against each other but also when you look at the

west it's like the thunder and spurs are probably going to have like three guys in play a piece maybe

some of them will make maybe two more firm than others but three in play the wolves are going to

have aunt and lamello who's going to get a big fan vote in addition to however good the wolves are

this season yokech luca kadee I assume those guys are going to be there if they're healthy enough

Steph will be there if he's healthy enough the game is in Phoenix I believe so I would think

Devin Booker will probably make this team I think you'll probably deserve it anyway

I thought a lot about this well then you get into like the I mean I try to do my homework

I'll you know we're trying to answer the prompt I think you hit the thing there where it's like yeah

the thunder and the spurs might have three guys who qualify will they ever will both get three guys

very rarely and obviously they compete for the same sort of voting and so I would say if they play

well if you're if they are let's say the seventh seed around the time that all start voting

happens I could see them getting one like you I could see it especially the coaches like to have

a representative for a team that is exceeding expectations I think the question is if it comes

down to these teams are all in the same range let's say Dallas Utah Portland are they going to

pick marketing over John Moran are they going to pick marketing over Cooper flag like you know who are

who is the fan vote and the player vote and the coach vote kind of tilting toward I guess it's

coach only for reserves really yes like who are they tilting toward at that point in time I feel like

the coaches honestly do till when they vote you would think they would vote for the well-rounded

players the supporting players the defensive guys I feel like more often than not they pick offensive

drivers and so I think someone like jaw if he's having a pretty decent John Moran season would

probably make it over someone like marketing almost they all hate him maybe this is a possibility

you think I'm still first going to win with an injury replacement and be like John Moran hey I

know we haven't talked in a while John last I heard you were doing rehab right now that go what an

incredible turn of events that would be so I can see I think I think the heart of the question is

ultimately like will they have a player playing at that level it sounds like we think approximately

if not Laura I think the big question is like John Jay yeah seem like he was just like I'm

knocking on the door of that level of offensive player if this is an offensive tilt a team which I

think it will be I mean I just don't know that the primacy is going to be there necessarily for

keyante or I mean I guess another question be just like it is Peterson also going to have the

oxygen to be a factor and you know what's he going to have to do be rookie to your conversation

we didn't talk about jaren you didn't have a bounce back here definitely could get buried among some

of the other offensive leaning guys but if they're like if they're really like top four West

good at the stage of the season they might want to get to and maybe that's the case right I think

I think what we're saying is that the jazz are going to have good players who are maybe a need of

a narrative to get into the awards conversations and that's why we're here that's not only why we're

here but let's say by some stroke of whatever the Utah jazz are the eighth to 10th best defense in

the league by the time voting is rolling around and jaren jackson juniors rack and up blocks looking

like his old self defensive player the year form that's a case I could see kind of cementing

and starting to get some momentum behind it I also could see him his foul problem being exacerbated

by the fact that they can't guard the ball of course anything else you want to mention with the jazz

we haven't talked about ace Bailey who is kind of buried by circumstance but one of the things that

I love most about this jazz team is just the length that they have across a bunch of different

positions what they do with that length is kind of an open question and that's sort of the store

of ace's career too it's like are you are you a bigger wing who's going to play like a bigger wing

or you a bigger wing who's just going to shoot over the top of people which is cool but has its

limits I think ace has the potential to be one of the better and more interesting bench players

in the league with this lineup with this group kind of plugging a lot of holes if he decides to

kind of work into those ways I just don't know what kind of player he is yet even after a somewhat

impressive season last year defensive buy is going to be huge for him because he has the potential to be

like add like help side room protection he gets to the freaking moon like off of like zero I mean he

just oh yeah great athlete super super long and slinky it's just like his investment and that's

out of the balls of place where he could like really really win over that coaching staff I think

and and get a lot more run and be more central because the shots are going to be like we said it's

even from last year this year for him I mean they're probably going to be tougher to come by

the cruel irony of landing on a team where like after wanting to have your own team and be the guy

he's the one who would make the most sense being forced into a role and being like you have to

fit around what we've got established which is unfortunate I still think we've maybe not talked

enough about Darren Peterson because we're so excited about these other pieces but how seriously

should we be thinking about him as a rookie of the year candidate what do we think he's going to be

capable of in year one what do we think he's going to be asked to do in year one I don't think

it'll get enough opportunities in order to be rookie of the year yeah which is accounting

and so if Chante is already in that role I mean it's going to be hard for Peterson this is my

concern overall for them just as a back court do it like we've talked about this in the past like

do we see two like offensive just like spark plug like scores coexist in the same back court

in the way that they are I have overlapping skills but like it is incumbent on them to make sure

that they do round out their games in order to allow for this other guy to have his one of you've

heard but Darren Peterson's a point makes it he makes it very clear that he is a point

guard okay I don't know what I don't I don't I I is that the role that he played last season I think

that I think that preference and circumstance might be at odds a little bit here because I I

absolutely think he thinks of himself as a center of the offense everything ripples from me oh I

I believe that yes I think on this particular team they might be most efficient similar to Charlotte

I think they might be most efficient to play through the bigs a little bit more just because the

downhill stuff it has been a question with him as it's been with Chante Chante has like a

dress with those things what's going to be interesting is that Darren's pursuit like bucket lust

has always sort of run the risk of flowing over into wastefulness he is a brilliant shopmaker for

his age she's got a lot of different tools it's going to be interesting to see how they negotiate

the margins of like hunt in a little too much because he can be brilliant they he'll probably have

a like a 40 point game I wouldn't shock if that happens is rookie year it's just kind of negotiating

those two things is going to be a challenge for I think for will already that's that I think

that could be super fun to watch because I think one of the most undercovered part of Chante George's

pop was yes he's had a ton of pick and roll usage over the first couple years in his career but I

think really what made him sing last year was curling off the ball like all the variety of actions

that the jazz were tapping into to put him in positions to score it was not just like top of the

floor high pick and roll over and over and over he was flying around and he's such a good shooter

and he's turning to like such a good balanced player working off the dribble that if Darren Peter

sends lots into that same thing and has the shooting pedigree that we've been talking about he should

be a flame to offer them yeah all right let's wrap it there that's it for part three of the

preseason power against how you guys feeling exhausted yeah no I'm alive what are we talking about this

has been our liveliest episode yet somehow talk a little shit to Rob he's often running there you

go there we go all right thank you to Victoria Valencia thank you to Ben Cruz we'll be back with

part four on Monday we'll talk to you then

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